LandlordZONE

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Oct, 2014

Wednesday

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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
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    525

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    Normal type is a euro lock (thumb turn) but some older wooden doors these are difficult to fit, I will get round to getting them all up to spec and changing doors if I have to, its just such a nightmare though and can be costly.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Manchester
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    222

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    Quote Originally Posted by hech123 View Post
    Surely it could be argued that if a break glass is there containing a key then it can immediately be opened as it takes 3 seconds to break the glass and grab the key?
    The concept of doors being “readily available without the use of a key” really comes from the likely human behaviour of people in fire situations. In real fire situations people panic and haven’t got the time to fumble with break glass boxes and keys in locks, seconds really can count. The same applies when I have inspected care homes etc in the past with coded number locks on final exit doors which for the same reasons are not permitted even with a simple code like 1,2,3,4. Care staff in panic situations have been known to forget a simple code like this.

    Can you confirm what type of property it is? Also if you did have a break glass key box what do they break the glass with? Are you intending to provide a hammer?

    If the premises is a HMO and the Local Authority are enforcing I doubt you would get any movement on this issue….sorry.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Manchester
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    222

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    Quote Originally Posted by ram View Post
    If it were me, I would say to the council.
    There are thousands of similar properties, private and HMO that have
    entrance doors with just one Yale type lock.
    If you are not satisfied with a motice lock with key for every resident,
    and a key hanging up next to the door ( behind glass so the buggers
    don't steal it,) and not happy with a yale type lock to replace
    a motice lock, which by the way is an insurance recommendation,
    then please visit the premises and give me a part number, a picture,
    and a supplier of a lock that will satisfy your excessive needs.

    That way you have shown willingness to comply, but to comply
    only with information they supply, as they MUST know what they
    need, therefore they should show you what you need.

    R.a.M.
    This would seem like a reasonable approach to the LA to me.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    525

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    Many thanks for your reply Darren. I have various properties I use this on, there is not usually a hammer but these break glasses are designed for keys and the slightest push shatters them. In 90-95% of my properties we have thumb turns and always in HMO's but in the odd terrace or block of flats I do have these.

    I can see they are best to be looked at and I will do this over time now after hearing all the replies. They are pretty sufficient but as I work through my properties improving various things these are one of the things I will look at. To be fair many landlords have mortice locks and very few even offer a break glass, I see from hundreds of properties I view, I am amazed at how little safety most of the landlords I see have in place.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    525

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    a link to one of these break glasses on amazon - http://www.amazon.co.uk/BREAK-PLASTI...9397947&sr=8-2

    Seems strange places still sell them if they are illegal, possibly for commercial I suppose.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    222

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    Quote Originally Posted by hech123 View Post
    In 90-95% of my properties we have thumb turns and always in HMO's but in the odd terrace or block of flats I do have these.

    I can see they are best to be looked at and I will do this over time now after hearing all the replies. They are pretty sufficient but as I work through my properties improving various things these are one of the things I will look at. To be fair many landlords have mortice locks and very few even offer a break glass, I see from hundreds of properties I view, I am amazed at how little safety most of the landlords I see have in place.
    Blocks of purpose built flats may be argued differently if the compartmentation is suitable for a stay put policy where only the occupant whose flat is on fire need evacuate. It could be said technically the staircase is not an "emergency escape route". However keys in boxes are not the norm and would raise concerns with an inspecting officer.

    I agree that there are many such properties where you may find little or no regard to the fire safety provisions. Unfortunately fire safety enforcement is going the same way as the HSE where prosecutions take place after the offence or incident and ignorance of fire safety law is no defence.

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