Garage to be used as living quarters ?

[Rodent1]

Hi All

Am in process of splitting a large vic end of tce into bedsits to let to local council...Prop has large garage which needs rebuilding ..applied for planning to build it 2 foot higher and make a 1 bed "coach house" out of it ..planning refused:mad:

now one year later i am considering rebuilding it as existing (to high spec) then iinternally splitting it into 2 rooms to be used as bedroom ...then joining to main building with temporary structure..covered walkway with glass doors (like a cheap conservatory/leanto) distance is approx 5m from main builing and "walkway" will go next to garden wall ..

Myquestion is do i need any kind of planning to use the building for living accom

Whole prop will be let as one 10 bed unit....

advice appreciated....
Simon

[Planner]

You will need planning AND building control permission.

[billmccallum]

The big question should be "why was permission refused?".

Is it worthwhile appealing?

Detailled discussion with planning officers usually resolve major issues before plans get to committee stage, we take great care in keeping them involved in the design stage, and changing design to meet their requirements, this usually resolves major issues and plans usually get approved.

[Rodent1]

Hear what you are saying guys...
But ..I am looking to replace existing Garage with same size building same position etc and from the outside exactly the same , it has 2 windows with dorr in the middle which i will replicate so from outside exactly the same ..As replacing existing i believe this does not require Planning P ....al though i am fully aware i will need building control which i will get?

now once finished a simple stud will divide in 2 internally and as i feel the cold dont really see a problem with extending the main house CH system to include 2 more rads ....also paranoid about fires so would extend fire alarm system to garage (in case my car caught fire!)

Upto this point i see no issues ??

Now i could use this as a garage/ hobby room/ shed/ games room etc
so what rule do i break by introducing a bed and wardobe ?

I could easily store a bed or sofa in there ...so would it be illegal to fall asleep in there ?

I guess the answer is going to be ...at my own home okay but not to let out ?


If this is the case is there any reason why i cant use the "lounge/communal room " as a bedroom and use the "garage" as lounge instead as it will be joined to house by leanto conservatory ?


If a house built with integral garage is converted to playroom etc does that also require PP ?

Appreciate all comments , thanks for your help.

Simon

[Rodent1]

The big question should be "why was permission refused?".

Is it worthwhile appealing?

Detailled discussion with planning officers usually resolve major issues before plans get to committee stage, we take great care in keeping them involved in the design stage, and changing design to meet their requirements, this usually resolves major issues and plans usually get approved.

Hi
Just pulled out the refusal letter:

1 the proposed development by virtue of its scale, design and location, would constitute a cramped form of development, out of keeping with existing development in the vicinity and detrimental to the visual amenities of th area, contrary to policy 11 of the Cardiff Local Planand policy 2.2 of the deposit Cardiff Unitary Development Plan.

2 The proposal would provide a poor living environment for occupiers of main house and future occupiers of the proposed dwelling by virtue of a lack of adequate amenity space, contrary to policy 2.24 of the deposit CUDP

3 No off street car parking facilities would be provided to compensate for the loss of the garage of the existing property, to the detriment of highway saftey and contrary to policy 2.57 of the deposit CUDP

Also verbally "over development!"

Simon

[billmccallum]

1 Are there other properties close to (or in the general area) which reflect a similar street scene to the development you are proposing?

If so, you can appeal, citing existing development.

2 In what sense do they refer to amenity land? Garden???

Hopefully someone else can reply to this element of your question, not one I've come across before.

3 No off street parking.

It should be quite simple to add a couple of car parking spaces.

[Planner]

A number of issues;

- Normally you can build garages/shed etc under permitted development rights (PDR). However you cant use PDR (even if replacing an existing structure) if for example the building is within 20 meters of a highway (which it sounds like it is as its an end terrace). Even if you are replacing the current garage with a completley identical one, you may require planning permission if its excluded from PDR.

- The second issue is the conversion of it for living accomodation. You suggest that you will get building control for a garage (which i am sure you will), but the building control requirements for a habitable space are very different from that of a garage. As the garage isnt attached to the main house, adds a further complication from your aspect.

- Looking at the reasons for refusal ;
1) lots of local authorities are now refusing conversion of larger properties into flats due to the sheer number of new build apartments that are springing up everywhere and the loss of family accomodation. A converted garage, is obviously not suitable family accomodation.

2) Self explanatory really, its a garage!!!. Obviously the houses grounds where once meant to serve just a single family, they are now expected to serve however many flats the main house has been converted too plus potentially the converted garage.

3) Again self explanatory really, the garage would hav potentially provided for the parking requirements of a single family that would have once lived there. Potentially the occupiers of the converted garage are to have at least one car as well as potentially the occupiers of the converted house. I dont think it will be easy to creat new off street parking as suggested in light of refusal 2 above.