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Selidor
08-07-2005, 16:43 PM
I'm sorry to be dim, but could somebody help reassure me that I've got
the correct expiry date for an S21 (the 4A one for a periodic tenancy).

Unfortunately (!), we rotted up the tenancy agreement a bit.......

At the top it says "made on 15th February 2004)". This bit's correct.
But then clause 2 says "The tenancy shall be for a term of 12 months from and including 17th August 2003."
Clause 3 says "The rent to be payable in advance on 17th of each month during the term".

I think the expiry date of the S21 4A should be 16th September.

Any help welcomed......

Thanks

dazalock
08-07-2005, 17:05 PM
I may be corrected here but here goes:

The tenancy has lapsed into a periodic tenancy with rent due on the 17th of each month, therefore, you should submit the Section 21 (4) (a) now to end after 16th September 2005. This gives you 2 clear months from the start of a rental month, if you deliver the notice after 16th July you will have to move the end date after 16th October 2005.

:eek: Waits for a good telling off

Paul_f
12-07-2005, 08:27 AM
I'm sorry to be dim, but could somebody help reassure me that I've got
the correct expiry date for an S21 (the 4A one for a periodic tenancy).

Unfortunately (!), we rotted up the tenancy agreement a bit.......

At the top it says "made on 15th February 2004)". This bit's correct.If so, then did the tenancy start on this date, you don't say? All you have said is this date was when the tenancy agreement was signed - is this correct?
But then clause 2 says "The tenancy shall be for a term of 12 months from and including 17th August 2003." Is the year wrong, the date, or both?
Clause 3 says "The rent to be payable in advance on 17th of each month during the term".

I think the expiry date of the S21 4A should be 16th September.

Any help welcomed......

Thanks

NEVER say you're dim - you probably made a mistake, but that doesn't mean you're not otherwise intelligent!

lawstudent
12-07-2005, 09:11 AM
I may be corrected here but here goes:

The tenancy has lapsed into a periodic tenancy with rent due on the 17th of each month, therefore, you should submit the Section 21 (4) (a) now to end after 16th September 2005. This gives you 2 clear months from the start of a rental month, if you deliver the notice after 16th July you will have to move the end date after 16th October 2005.

:eek: Waits for a good telling offbend over young man! you are almost right, so you will only be given two strokes of the cane on the naked buttocks for failing to point out that even if you deliver the notice ON 16 July it will be too late, as the 16th is a Saturday and the notice will not be deemed to have been served until the 18 July. For my new-found wisdom on this matter I am indebted to Paul f and his recent quiz.

lawstudent
12-07-2005, 09:15 AM
PS ... to be sure the notice incontrovertibly provides 2 months it would be best to serve it no later than this Thursday (the 14th)

dazalock
12-07-2005, 10:23 AM
bend over young man! you are almost right, so you will only be given two strokes of the cane on the naked buttocks for failing to point out that even if you deliver the notice ON 16 July it will be too late, as the 16th is a Saturday and the notice will not be deemed to have been served until the 18 July. For my new-found wisdom on this matter I am indebted to Paul f and his recent quiz.


Indeed yes, like you, I am now weekend shy.

;)

Selidor
14-07-2005, 07:45 AM
Thanks to all for your responses.

Paul f: the tenancy began on 15th Feb 04, and rent has been due (although rarely paid!) on 15th of each month.

The date in clause 2 (17th August) is totally incorrect, year and date. (We re-used an old tenancy agreement, but in a rush we only altered the names and date the agreement was made - though I'd have thought the letting agent might have noticed as they signed the agreement on our behalf)

We'll be much more careful in future!

Paul_f
14-07-2005, 08:50 AM
If the letting agent signed it on your behalf then I would be demanding they sort it out on your behalf at no cost to you. Agents who sign AST's don't realise what they are letting themselves in for as they must carry the can for their mistakes! I NEVER sign AST's even when the landlord lives abroad - I always send it to them.

On the point of service of S.21 Notices, the last day of a periodic (monthly) tenancy shall be disregarded as far as notices are concerned so you would have to have served it at least the day before (13th) and having followed S.196 of the Law of Property Act 1925, if it was not served personally on the tenant. See my thread "Question Time (3)", and the subsequent answers for a full explanation.

Selidor
19-07-2005, 16:29 PM
Thanks - it's all a lot clearer now!

Would it be possible to start proceedings through the small claims court as soon as the rent is in arrears, while we know where the tenant is? (I realise this will cost us, but at least we have an address at the moment, and we have some chance of getting something from him!)

Also, probably a very basic question, but could you please explain why the rent has to be unpaid for 2 months before a section 8 can be sent - why not 1 month and 1 day, as it is contracted to be paid a month in advance?

Paul_f
20-07-2005, 18:31 PM
The answer is in the thread I posted only 2 days ago!!!

http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=641

It's post #5 :rolleyes:

Selidor
29-07-2005, 14:36 PM
Sorry for the long delay in response - a few technical problems!

First - I've now read your post about when the rent is in arrears - sorry I didn't look properly before.

I'm still in a bit of a quandary about when it is possible to go to the small claims court - I have searched but not found anything very specific.

Thanks agaiin for your help.