let the buyer beware? faulty electrics, and plumbing

[slyrubies]

bought a place last year, that the vendors had done up to a very high standard. The place looked absolutely fantastic. However, the make over was a show and go deal. IE it looked very attractive to the untrained eye. However, after my builders started work on the flat they uncovered serious problems with the electrics and serious issues with the plumbing.

We had to basically re-wire most of the downstairs (kitchen and living room) and actually replace a boiler which was illegally placed.

Now the vendor left behind a few items at our request and we agreed a price of £220. However, I feel slightly agreived that he basically sold us a faulty product which cost thousands to put right.

He is threatening going to the small claims court for this £220 for the items he left behind. Can we mount a counter claim with any degree of credibility for his deceitful DIY cover up?

or am I shafted by Caveat Emptor? ie "let the buyer beware"?

[Dan]

A warning to all potential purchasers! Didn't you have a survey done before buying. If so I would have thought you'd have some recourse against the surveyor.

[slyrubies]

yeah but I think there are different levels of survey and the one I opted for was the most minimal, ie lowest charge but least thorough inspection, so I'm not sure whether that kind of thing will be covered by it.

However, one thing I have learnt the hard way is to have an electrical inspector and corgi engineer have a look at the premises before making an offer on future properties.

This still doesn't solve my current problem though:

Do I have a case to hold back the £220 and start a counter claim for his stealth DIY tactics costing me a few grand?

[davidjohnbutton]

You need to go back to the pre contract enquiries which your solicitor will have a copy of from when you bought the place.

See what statements have been made regarding the points in dispute. If you can prove that the seller deliberately or negligently mislead you about the condition of wiring and plumbing/heating, then you have a case for sueing him for the cost of putting it right.

What I would, in your shoes do, is pay him the money for the bits he left behind as if you don't, you in turn will be in breach of your agreement to pay him for those - whilst you might consider there is "set off" i.e. you are withholding a part of what you "think" you are owed - he in turn has a contractual agreement with you for you to pay him and a judge looking at the case might not allow you to "set off" a disputed potential liability against one in which there is a clear contractual liability.

I appreciate this might not be the answer you want to hear - but parting with this money actually would put you on a stronger footing and reduce the allegations flying about when you (if you are indeed able to) sue him for the faults.

When you pay him, make sure you get a receipt.

[slyrubies]

ok thanks for the advice mate, will probably do something along the lines of what are you are suggesting. I've never actually had to use the small claims court yet, so I am looking into how that whole process works a bit more...

[ourlol]

A word of caution perhaps re suing!! There is a moral to this tale but for the life of me I've never fathomed it out.

The property in which I live was bought in 1987 with the benefit of a full survey. I used the company who were doing the valuation report for the company providing the mortage. Within days of moving in a number of issues arose (i.e. water flooding through an extension flat roof... which according to the report was supposedly only 12 months old, the necessity of an emergency rewire after it was condemed... which again had ostensibly been recently rewired) that caused us to question the survey. Cutting a long story short, after employing a structural engineer to look at the property we discovered (amongst other things) that the loft conversion was unsupported and the perlins to the roof had been cut. The entire structure was pivoting on the bedroom ceilings!! To the trained eye there were plenty of indicators to show that something was badly amiss. Faced with the massive costs of putting it right we sought legal advice and sued. It was a high court proceeding. Over the course of some 6-7 years we continued with the action, during which time we amassed over £65,000 legal costs (which we had to pay up front and was rather more than we had been quoted LOL) and due to the state of my nerves (coupled with looking after my young family) paid out to correct the fault to the property as I found I couldn't live wondering if the house was going to collapse. In 1992 we had the final hearing and we won!! HOWEVER, within weeks we discovered (and it was only then) that the company of surveyors had breached their professional liability insurance by offering us £1050 at the beginning (before involving the insurance company). That invalidated the cover and whilst the partners stated they would like to pay us, they did not have the personal financial resources to do so. We were back to square one. We tried unsuccessfully to recover our money via county bailiffs and then dismissing our solicitors, tried ourselves to bring bankrupcy proceedings against three of the partners. What happened then is long and protracted. Needless to say, we were forced to enter into an IVA (Individual Voluntary Arrangement) which over the course of 4 years provided us with little over £2000 for our troubles.

I now have a huge mortgage for my troubles and the experience has left its mark. That said, my young daughter became very critically ill at the end of this very sorry saga and that made me realise very quickly that we were talking about bricks and mortar... there was worse things that could happen. My daughter survived and I (for my sanity) have tried since to lay this particular ghost to rest.

I end, as I started... proceed with caution if you choose to sue.
Laura