Kitchen units that will not date

[Bel]

I am thinking of replacing a kitchen and do not want it to 'date ' too quickly. It will be a laminate worktop and cheaper cost unit

Members suggestions please

What colour or effect (eg wood) on the worktop
What colour or effect on units
What material for the units (or what not to use eg vinyl warpped, melamine, wood)
What door style on the units (eg flush, shaker panel, cathedral arch)
Handle style
Style of extractor fan
Other recommendations

Web links helpful

Cheers

[jta]

Bel. If the carcasses of the old units are still good, why not just fit new doors etc. to give the kitchen an uplift? That along with new worktops can be done fairly cheaply.
I did one recently and found no big problems doing it other than some of the doors had slightly different fixings, easily fixed with a few tools. It cost me under £300 to do about 12 units including one new carcass.

[Springfields]

We fitted a new kitchen in one of our houses earlier in the year and got the carcasses from ebay..... a lot of seller on there are selling MFI stock very cheap (about 50% or less) and the quality is ok.

[Moderator1]

Less-serious posts have been moved/copied from this thread to http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?33396-Kitchen-units-that-will-not-date

[Bel]

Bel. If the carcasses of the old units are still good, why not just fit new doors etc. to give the kitchen an uplift? That along with new worktops can be done fairly cheaply.
I did one recently and found no big problems doing it other than some of the doors had slightly different fixings, easily fixed with a few tools. It cost me under £300 to do about 12 units including one new carcass.

The carcassess will definately end up in a skip with this one.

I have done a few kitchens in Howdens beech for other people; tenants seem to like it at the mo'.

This flat is mine, and in a more upmarket area. I prefer white. I was going to do flush door white and possibly a wood effect laminate top.

Do you think those triangular stainless steel extrators will soon look dated? I'm not that keen. But I stand to be corrected.

[mind the gap]

Hi Bel,

I've heard good things about Howdens' kitchens; Magnet also have some very solid ones. I don't think the plain/Shaker style ones will date. Look at Moben (a bit pricier, but classic). Oddly enough the higher prices IKEA ones are well worth the money and whatever people say about IKEA, their kitchens always work and the built in appliances have a 10 year guarantee, which is pretty rare these days. They also have a nice shiny white cabinet range, which I've seen in a friend's house and it looks impressive.

Not sure about the wood-effect laminate. If it isn't a tenanted house I would go for real wood (Danish oiled or whatever for waterproofing). Something like this: http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/40146524

[leaseholdanswers]

One option is to go for good carcasses, and cheaper doors that can be updated.

It all depends on the type of property the competition and the type of tenant. I have refurbed a block of 10 (in an entry level city business type property) and I opted for fairly neutral finishes in colour and design, a real wood worksurface, but dressed them with fashionable/trendy items*, which are easier to update and change.

To be honest I let an assistant loose on the internet, which then rapidly became a group of 3 ladies and a trip to John Lewis. A retail therapy day to remember!

[Bel]

Hi Bel,


Not sure about the wood-effect laminate. If it isn't a tenanted house I would go for real wood (Danish oiled or whatever for waterproofing). Something like this: http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/40146524

Solid wood (oiled) will be difficult to keep nice with tenants?

[Scrungy]

I would go with a plain-ish cabinet design, shaker-style is good.
More ornate designs tend to jar with some people and are annoyingly super at attracting dust, grime, etc., over time, and exacerbated as tenants rarely clean cabinet doors.

I changed my kitchen a few years ago to this kind of style from Wickes (Marlow), with a granite-look speckled worktop.
I didn't buy their cabinet handles, preferring some curved stainless steel ones instead.

I chose a white finish as my kitchen is small and a darker finish makes the kitchen feel smaller.
I wouldn't go for coloured appliances as these date more quickly and tend to be harder on the eye than white or stainless steel.

The extractor hood should be in the same finish as the cooker/oven and its best to vent to the outside rather than just pushing the air and grease back into the kitchen which is what happens with the cheaper models..

I would recommend getting worktops that have an upstand rather than going straight to tiles with a seal in between, as this area gets grimy over time and becomes difficult to clean, again because tenants rarely clean very well.
Sometimes the kitchen fitters can make this upstand up from pieces of worktop but it needs to be done well to avoid the same problem as the effect of not having one.

Also, I don't skimp on appliances as their failure is a real hassle and outweighs the cheaper price that you got initially. This lesson has been learned over many years.

Make sure the ceiling lighting is good and also, lights under the wall cabinets gives the kitchen a nice look and cost very little.

[leaseholdanswers]

Solid wood (oiled) will be difficult to keep nice with tenants?

Where you think the risk is higher, cheaper easily replaced worktops might be better. That said solid wooden surfaces if pre treated and maintained can be resurrected from even a burn mark. ( I am married to a trainee pyromaniac!)

[westminster]

I think those hi-gloss finish doors will soon be out of date. Also, anything wrapped with foil or veneered etc will peel/lift in the end.

Painted wood or spray-lacquered MDF can both be restored to life very easily. Ikea do lacquered doors for their units - 'Applad' - they only come in black or white currently, but it's not that expensive to have something spray-lacquered. And it means you can have extra bits/panels made to match, because Ikea's range doesn't always have the bits you need.

Flush or Shaker panel are both classic styles which won't date. I'd spend a bit extra on good quality nickel handles on a flush door, or semi-'invisible' finger pulls; on Shaker style, round wooden knobs painted to match the door.

I prefer extractors built-in and hidden in an over-hob cabinet. If that's not an option, then as plain as possible and no bits of glass.

My general view is that the trend for super-modern Ikea-catalogue-look will pass, and people will return to a slightly more cosy, trad look - in period properties anyway. You see a lot of highly modernised period homes for sale/rent and I look at them and think they could benefit from a bit of demodernisation. I mean put back the cornicing etc, not faux Tudor wrought iron handles.

I like some of the Plain English kitchens; the plainer ones are both classic/modern. (For inspiration only, as the prices are unbelievable).
http://www.plainenglishdesign.co.uk/

Other thoughts: Splashbacks - don't tile in white with white grout as the grout will go grey. Simple solution is to have a small upstand at the back, and paint the rest of the wall in washable paint and have a same-colour back-coated piece of glass behind the hob. Don't get a real wood worktop next to the sink as it will inevitably discolour or warp over time, even if you oil it assiduously (which is a drag). If you get a granite worktop in a light colour, don't have grooves cut next to the sink as they will discolour over time.

Other links
http://www.willowandstone.co.uk/
http://www.sdslondon.co.uk/

[jeffrey]

Work surfaces that are resilient- granite or some similar material- and plenty of them: they're a desideratum too.

[mind the gap]

Work surfaces that are resilient- granite or some similar material- and plenty of them: they're a desideratum too.

Well, if you ask me it's just plain greed and people getting ideas above 'emselves. In my day, we thought ussens lucky to 'ave a mouldy plank o' wood laid across two buckets for a work surface.

[jeffrey]

Two buckets? That's beyond the pail.

[Bel]

Thanks for a very thorough post, Westminster :)

[leaseholdanswers]

Thanks for a very thorough post, Westminster :)

In one student house ( for 16!) after another year of knackered units, I had recycled catering stainless steel units fitted. They are free standing with a tie in to the wall or floor. It worked a treat. Perhaps not what you are looking for though!

[westminster]

Yes, stainless steel is very practical, ideal for a rental, though I once had a kitchen with s/steel worktops and it shows up watermarks, so if you're fussy about keeping things looking spotless then it's a bit of a chore.

http://www.hunterneil.co.uk/

[mind the gap]

I sometimes wonder why we provide worktops at all in our student house. Last time we went up there the kitchen surfaces were covered with books, booze, toiletries, skiing and golf paraphernalia, a traffic sign and and a malevolent-looking cactus, but no sign of any food preparation. Perhaps a microwave oven, a corkscrew and a giant bin for empty Pot Noodle tubs is all some students need in the way of culinary equipment?

[leaseholdanswers]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuJD1-1e-i4

It's few minutes but it is the ultimate kitchen designed by and for men. Wait for around 3.18.

I was very lucky to be in the studio audience for this segment.

For the cooking on the job site try this- especially the cheese sandwich about 50s in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tX852PNNlk&feature=related

[Bel]

I was looking at people's NYC apartment walk-throughs on youtube. They are so tiny! SOme of them still have huge cookers and fridges in kitchens without room for much else.

Anyways, one guy had what he called a tiny cooker (usual UK size) and next to it was a phone on the wall; which he cited as the most important piece of cooking equipment, because they always call for take-out !

[westminster]

I don't think people cook much in NYC, there are hardly any supermarkets. The ones which do exist sell fairly low quality food, or you get the other extreme of super-expensive delis full of foreign delicacies - but not the sort of stuff you need to make a shepherd's pie etc. It's actually cheaper to order a takeaway, and because everybody eats takeaways, there's far more choice and higher quality than you get over here.

[Bel]

Interesting.

I also noticed that nobody has a washing machine either; its just accepted that people use communal laundry facilities I suppose.

[leaseholdanswers]

I was looking at people's NYC apartment walk-throughs on youtube. They are so tiny! SOme of them still have huge cookers and fridges in kitchens without room for much else.

Anyways, one guy had what he called a tiny cooker (usual UK size) and next to it was a phone on the wall; which he cited as the most important piece of cooking equipment, because they always call for take-out !

Or as agents used to like to call them Galley Style kitchens!

[jeffrey]

I was looking at people's NYC apartment walk-throughs on youtube. They are so tiny!
But is this not also true of the minuscule BTL flats thrown-up (until recently) in the UK?

[mind the gap]

One of the most efficient kitchens I have ever had was also the smallest.

[jeffrey]

Who mentioned efficiency? The discussion was about kitchen sizes and inadequacy.

[mind the gap]

Who mentioned efficiency? The discussion was about kitchen sizes and inadequacy.

The two are connected. Presumably the ideal is a kitchen which is well-planned and thus efficient. My point was that a kitchen does not have to be large to be efficient. Conversely, large kitchens, whilst sociable, can be less efficient as they can involve a lot of to-ing and fro-ing from fridge to cooker to sink to dishwasher to bin and back again. The small kitchen I had was great - you could stand in one place when preparing and cooking food and reach just about everything, but there was still room to work. Storage is of course crucial.

[Bel]

The two are connected. Presumably the ideal is a kitchen which is well-planned and thus efficient. My point was that a kitchen does not have to be large to be efficient. Conversely, large kitchens, whilst sociable, can be less efficient as they can involve a lot of to-ing and fro-ing from fridge to cooker to sink to dishwasher to bin and back again. The small kitchen I had was great - you could stand in one place when preparing and cooking food and reach just about everything, but there was still room to work. Storage is of course crucial.

http://www.digsdigs.com/very-small-kitchen-which-has-everything-needed-circle-kitchen/

[mind the gap]

http://www.digsdigs.com/very-small-kitchen-which-has-everything-needed-circle-kitchen/

I like it! You'd build up some muscles, spinning that thing round and round, wouldn't you! It could almost double as a home gym.

I wouldn't bother installing one in the middle of that vast room shown in the ad, though...

[Bel]

I like it! You'd build up some muscles, spinning that thing round and round, wouldn't you! It could almost double as a home gym.

I wouldn't bother installing one in the middle of that vast room shown in the ad, though...

Do you think they could make one for a combined loo and shower?

[mind the gap]

Do you think they could make one for a combined loo and shower?

Ha! You wouldn't want to be the person stuck in the shower/loo on 'the dark side' when someone else arrives to use it, if you see what I mean!

[Brixtonia]

Hi Bel,

I've heard good things about Howdens' kitchens; Magnet also have some very solid ones. I don't think the plain/Shaker style ones will date. Look at Moben (a bit pricier, but classic). Oddly enough the higher prices IKEA ones are well worth the money and whatever people say about IKEA, their kitchens always work and the built in appliances have a 10 year guarantee, which is pretty rare these days. They also have a nice shiny white cabinet range, which I've seen in a friend's house and it looks impressive.

Not sure about the wood-effect laminate. If it isn't a tenanted house I would go for real wood (Danish oiled or whatever for waterproofing). Something like this: http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/40146524

Are you sure about the 10yr guarantee on Ikea appliances? I always install Ikea kitchens (about 25-30 to date) but never use their appliances or worktops. The 10yr warranty on Ikea kitchens appears to specifically exclude appliances.

That said - I would thoroughly recommend the units. The first one I installed was in 1998 and I recently took it out and moved it to my girlfriend's rental flat where it still looks great!

[mind the gap]

I'm pretty sure. The reason I know this is because about 4 years ago we bought an IKEA dishwasher and it broke down after only 15 months. When we first complained to Customer Services the repsonse was 'Sorry, but as it's over a year old, it's out of guarantee - nothing we can do. ' (Except send someone out to look at it, at vast expense to us). The employee happened to let slip that if it had been a d/w bought a few months later, it would have had a 10 year guarantee "like all new IKEA appliances". The unfairness of this rankled a bit, so I persevered up the food chain. To cut a long story short, they agreed to replace it for free (having seen how much we have spent at the place over the years!) - and the new one does indeed have a 10 year guarantee. Our friends with a new IKEA kitchen also mentioned that their applicances had the 10 yr guarantee.

[Brixtonia]

I'm pretty sure. The reason I know this is because about 4 years ago we bought an IKEA dishwasher and it broke down after only 15 months. When we first complained to Customer Services the repsonse was 'Sorry, but as it's over a year old, it's out of guarantee - nothing we can do. ' (Except send someone out to look at it, at vast expense to us). The employee happened to let slip that if it had been a d/w bought a few months later, it would have had a 10 year guarantee "like all new IKEA appliances". The unfairness of this rankled a bit, so I persevered up the food chain. To cut a long story short, they agreed to replace it for free (having seen how much we have spent at the place over the years!) - and the new one does indeed have a 10 year guarantee. Our friends with a new IKEA kitchen also mentioned that their applicances had the 10 yr guarantee.

That's amazing if it is true! Still can't find anything on their website - seems crazy that they are not shouting about it. Am about to specify three kitchens and that would definitely swing my appliances specification.

[Brixtonia]

I emailed Ikea - they replied that the max appliance warranty is 5yrs, although some are still just 1. Even so, 5yrs is pretty impressive as a standard warranty and would have saved my a few quid over the past years. Thanks for the tip MTG.

[jeffrey]

Must be security of ten-year.

[mind the gap]

I emailed Ikea - they replied that the max appliance warranty is 5yrs, although some are still just 1. Even so, 5yrs is pretty impressive as a standard warranty and would have saved my a few quid over the past years. Thanks for the tip MTG.
You're welcome - sorry if I got your hopes up too high with the 10 year thing, but as you say 5 yrs is pretty good. Ours is definitely 10, but that must have been a special deal/offer.

I am very impressed that you got any sense out of IKEA customer services by email - I always seem to end up on the phone to them for hours on 'hold,' with only Vivaldi for company. I hate Vivialdi now.

[Always Problems]

Why not give your existing kitchen a facelift. When I was selling my house my units looked "dated" as I had bought them 20 years before.
So I painted the doors with a coat of white undercoat, rubbed it down with 800's wet and dry, then painted them with a White Satin" topcoat. I put new door handles on and the kitchen looked brand new. If your sink is stainless steel you can make it look like new with T Cut.
Anyway the results were good enough as the house sold. So even if you are selling or offering it up for rent, its first impressions that count.
Why go to the expense of a new kitchen or new doors when 2 tins of paint and a bit of time will suffice.

[Always Problems]

I have done a few kitchens in Howdens beech
.

If you are near a STAX wholesalers you should have a look at their Kitchens. I was told that there are only 3 manufacturers of kitchen units in the UK. One is GOWER. I went to Howdens to look at a kitchen and their kitchens looked like Gower. I went to FOCUS and it was the same as the one I had. So I go back to Stax for another unit with doors to match my existing and they had brought in a new range, so I had to go to Focus to match up. Anyway Stax is cheap. Only last week there were 11 pallets going to S Ireland. And the car park is always full of vans belonging to joiners, plumbers etc. This is where the trade go, forget B&Q Warehouse. This is the real thing.