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robrob25
01-04-2010, 09:32 AM
I am a subtenant paying rent to someone who is subletting without the landlords permission. I am wanting to move out and have given a months notice, however I am being told by the subletter that I have to find a replacement to move in before I move out. I was never told this when I initially moved in and to further complicate things the subletter then informed me the lease runs out this August (again, I wasn't told this when moved in) so that would make finding someone for such a short term period doubly difficult.

I don't really think I'm obligated to find someone and would rather just move out asap so my question is, if I just find a place and make arrangements to leave, legally, the subletter can't hold onto my deposit? It's just that I foresee issues like this if/when I announce I won't be finding a replacement...

Snorkerz
01-04-2010, 10:30 AM
Can you clarify, does the 'sub-letter' live in the property with you - ie do you just have a room?

robrob25
01-04-2010, 11:11 AM
Subletter lives in a room upstairs.

Snorkerz
01-04-2010, 11:27 AM
Subletter lives in a room upstairs.If that is part of the very same property, and he shares facilities with you, kitchen, bathroom etc, then he is not sub-letting, and you do not have a tenancy as such.

You are what is called an excluded occupier. This means you don't have the same rights as a tenant - but you have less responsibilities also.

Leave as you plan to. Assuming the 'landlord' doesn't give you your deposit back because of you leaving, write him a polite letter saying you will have to go to court if it's not paid within 14 days. If he doesn't pay - go to www.moneyclaim.gov.uk and start a claim against him - it isn't difficult.

robrob25
06-04-2010, 21:43 PM
Hi, had a post not so long ago about subletting that was answered well by snorkerz. However, something else has arisen. Basically, this person is sort of subletting to me (as an excluded occupier) without the landlords permission. The landlord has no idea I am here. Since giving notice, suddenly the "subletter" is finding things I have "damaged" but which I actually havent. I am thinking, if she is going to threaten to take money off my deposit what rights do I have and if she gets really intense is there a way for me to counter her by reporting that she is subletting without the landlords permission? Surely there is something that can be done about that

robrob25
06-04-2010, 21:48 PM
Also, sorry, is there a proper way of contesting her claim that I've damaged said item? I'm thinking, perhaps if she does deduct it from the deposit I can write her a letter claiming for the money back and if she doesn't reply within 14 days start proceedings..?

robrob25
06-04-2010, 22:44 PM
Also, I signed an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement in accordance with Section 19a Housing Act 1988, but having re-read it I'm not sure this is correct as our "subletter" lives in the property. This is not a subletting agreement, surely, but an agreement we'd probably have signed with the actual landlord (had they known we were moving in)

westminster
06-04-2010, 23:46 PM
MODERATOR: Please merge with OP's previous thread
http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=27318


I am thinking, if she is going to threaten to take money off my deposit what rights do I have and if she gets really intense is there a way for me to counter her by reporting that she is subletting without the landlords permission? Surely there is something that can be done about that

Robrob: As Snorkerz explained on your previous thread, your landlady (i.e. the tenant of the property) isn't subletting. She doesn't need the 'head' landlord's permission to take in a lodger, and she has done nothing illegal. If the head landlord were to find out and be unhappy about it, the worst he could do would be to start legal proceedings to evict. (And unless your landlady is behind with the rent, it's most unlikely that the head landlord would obtain a possession order before the end of the fixed term in August).

Your rights re the deposit are again as Snorkerz previously explained - you can bring a county court claim against your landlady if she tries to make unfair deductions. She would then need to prove to the court that you are liable for the alleged damage - hard to do unless she has an inventory check-in report, etc.


Also, I signed an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement in accordance with Section 19a Housing Act 1988, but having re-read it I'm not sure this is correct as our "subletter" lives in the property.
Regardless of the title given to the contract you signed, the fact that you live in the same property as the landlady means your tenancy status is that of a lodger (a.k.a. excluded occupier), not an assured shorthold tenant. This doesn't make the contract 'invalid' as such - the terms you agreed remain in place - it just means that you do not have the security of tenure of an assured shorthold tenancy.

See
http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/renting_and_leasehold/private_tenancies/excluded_occupiers

Moderator1
07-04-2010, 02:43 AM
Two threads by the same member have been merged here. Please do not start a new thread if you merely wish to continue a previous discussion or report on subsequent developments. It can cause unnecessary confusion (quite apart from losing the connection with facts previously established or legal points previously explained).

chappers2341
07-04-2010, 06:43 AM
hard to do unless she has an inventory check-in report, etc.





not to mention the fact that she also lives in the property and could also be responsible for the damage, and just using you as a scapegoat to recover monies she may be deducted at the end of her tenancy.