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View Full Version : T's false references; using ground 17



maureen2
11-03-2010, 19:00 PM
Can i evict a tenant by giving me,a false reference.

Ericthelobster
11-03-2010, 19:10 PM
Can i evict a tenant by giving me,a false reference.

You wanna try that question again?

westminster
11-03-2010, 19:32 PM
Can i evict a tenant by giving me,a false reference.
More information required.



Rental property in England/Wales?
AST, assured tenancy, or lodger agreement?
Fixed term, if so, when did it start and when does it end?
Or is it periodic?
Did T pay a deposit and if deposit protection applies did you protect it?
Does T owe rent, if so, how much?
What false reference?

maureen2
11-03-2010, 19:34 PM
You wanna try that question again?

Sorry about that.

A couple of weeks ago my property became available, i placed an add in the local paper. I got quite a few responses but 1 guy stood out. A single parent who was living close bye was being evicted because his landlord was selling the property. He brought a glowing reference from the landlord. He stood out because he was already packed and was ready to move the next day.
We rang the landlord o check everything was ok and he spoke very highly saying he was selling the property and he was sorry to see the tennat move out. The stories matched.

The tennant gave the bond and moved in the next day.
A couple of days later a freind of a friend rang us to ask if we had let Mr X a property, which we had. He told us that the reference was his best friend and that he wasnt all he had said to be. So we went to his previous property and dropped a note through the door asking for the owner of the property if he would please get intouch. The following day we recieved a phone call from the supposed owner who again gave him a glowing reference.

Our friend rang back up and told us that the person who was posing as the owner was infact Mr X's friend and that he still had keys as the owner of the previous hose had no idea he was leaving. He said he would guve us a ring when he had eventually left the property. We recieved this phone call on Tuesday 9th March so the following day we went to post another letter. When we got the the real owner was there and the house was in a bit of a state and she said that she had not been paid for around 2 months and had not been informed the tennant was leaving.

So today i went to confront the tenant about the false references to see what he had to say. When i arrived at the house i could see the curtains twitching but got no answer at the door. i Went back to the car and tried to ring. I could see people/person moving around in the house. The phone wasnt answered so i knocked again, no reply. I sent the phone a text asking please answer the door, we need to talk about a few things?. He replied im in bed and would give me a ring later, there was a few things he wanted to talk to me about. I waited around for about 1hour hoping that he would just talk to me, nothing, so i gave up. I got back home and recieved a text saying that he didnt appreciate me hanging around his house and that i should make an appointment and he had been told that i wanted him out.

To be honest i dont think i do want him in now but that wasnt my intention when i went to see him. I was feeling "better the devil you know" and after all he was already in. But now he wont talk to me. I was in no way threatning as im not that type of person.

Any advice at all on my next course of acttion. im recieving advice saying get him out straight away from alot of people, especially his previous landlady.

Sorry for long winded message.

maureen2
11-03-2010, 19:39 PM
More information required.



Rental property in England/Wales?
AST, assured tenancy, or lodger agreement? Assured
Fixed term, if so, when did it start and when does it end?
Or is it periodic?
Did T pay a deposit and if deposit protection applies did you protect it?
Does T owe rent, if so, how much?
What false reference?


England
Assured
01/03/10 started
Not sure sorry
Deposit was 4 weeks rent in advance (£480), no bond asked for.
Only lived there 2 weeks, so no
As above.

Preston
11-03-2010, 22:27 PM
Have a look at ground 17, schedule 2, Housing Act 1988.

maureen2
12-03-2010, 06:44 AM
Have a look at ground 17, schedule 2, Housing Act 1988.

Thanks Preston.

"Ground 17
The landlord was persuaded to grant the tenancy on the basis of a false statement knowingly or recklessly made by the tenant, or a person acting at the tenant’s instigation."

So what is my next course of action please?

islandgirl
12-03-2010, 07:12 AM
I wouldn't get too excited! You will need to prove the story. Though I believe you a court needs proof. You would have to have witnesses and all written evidence. It will still take a lifetime. Better in my opinion to go down the section 8 route if he does not pay and section 21 at the end of the fixed term. What do others think?

maureen2
12-03-2010, 07:16 AM
Would the fact that i have the real owner of the property's telephone number and address to prove that she didnt give the reference?.

p_cas
12-03-2010, 08:12 AM
Did you get a written reference from the previous LL? I've said on here previously that a verbal reference is worthless, and I think this case proves the point. You don't know who you were speaking to.

Did you do any checks on this person? Credit checks, to see if they could afford the rent? Employer or other references?

Why didn't you asked for a deposit, as well as rent in advance?

Poppy
12-03-2010, 09:39 AM
2. AST, assured tenancy, or lodger agreement?
3. Fixed term, if so, when did it start and when does it end?




Assured
01/03/10 started
Are you sure this is an assured tenancy? Very rare for an assured tenancy to have started two weeks ago. Do you mean an assured shorthold tenancy (AST)?

mjbfire
12-03-2010, 09:51 AM
I know it doesn't help in your current situation,
But I always do Previous LL ref, but never rely on a good one, as some LL will miss out the bad bits just to get the T out and use Data Protection and slander exuse if you do pick them up on it.

So the best way is to use a referance agency and give a phone call to the previous LL, which I find you are more likely to find out the true story and can save a little time declining the T(Not accepting).
Also take a holding deposit, while doing the checks, as most people who are trying to con you, head for the door, normally with the excuse I am going to the cash machine and you never see them again.

There are a very few reasons why somebody can more in the next day, A previous LL selling P I have heard many times, but if a good T doesn't want to move it will take the LL 2/3 months to get them out so why the rush.

The other common one is I split with my partner and I need somewhere to live and please don't contact my previous LL as he may tell my abusive partner where I live. If true I feel for them, but more than likely it's a con.

There are good T out there, and most are honest, but if you get a bad one, the law is mostly on there side and they may look stupid but they know how to play the system.

My best advise, is to get a specilist lawyer onto the case, and get him to draw up all the papers, S8, S21, it may cost, but in the long run may cause you less stress and will stop any all the normal counter claims(Disrepear, Breach of quite enjoyment, haressment, illegal eviction), as he seems to knows how to play the system. Also don't go round to the properity any more, unless you have his written agreement.

jeffrey
12-03-2010, 10:12 AM
Thanks Preston.

"Ground 17
The landlord was persuaded to grant the tenancy on the basis of a false statement knowingly or recklessly made by the tenant, or a person acting at the tenant’s instigation."

So what is my next course of action please?
Serve s.8 Notice on g17. This is so whether it's an AST or an SAT, under the Housing Act 1988.

HairyLandlord
12-03-2010, 10:13 AM
Sorry about that.

A couple of weeks ago my property became available, i placed an add in the local paper. I got quite a few responses but 1 guy stood out. A single parent who was living close bye was being evicted because his landlord was selling the property. He brought a glowing reference from the landlord. He stood out because he was already packed and was ready to move the next day.
We rang the landlord o check everything was ok and he spoke very highly saying he was selling the property and he was sorry to see the tennat move out. The stories matched.

The tennant gave the bond and moved in the next day.
A couple of days later a freind of a friend rang us to ask if we had let Mr X a property, which we had. He told us that the reference was his best friend and that he wasnt all he had said to be. So we went to his previous property and dropped a note through the door asking for the owner of the property if he would please get intouch. The following day we recieved a phone call from the supposed owner who again gave him a glowing reference.

Our friend rang back up and told us that the person who was posing as the owner was infact Mr X's friend and that he still had keys as the owner of the previous hose had no idea he was leaving. He said he would guve us a ring when he had eventually left the property. We recieved this phone call on Tuesday 9th March so the following day we went to post another letter. When we got the the real owner was there and the house was in a bit of a state and she said that she had not been paid for around 2 months and had not been informed the tennant was leaving.

So today i went to confront the tenant about the false references to see what he had to say. When i arrived at the house i could see the curtains twitching but got no answer at the door. i Went back to the car and tried to ring. I could see people/person moving around in the house. The phone wasnt answered so i knocked again, no reply. I sent the phone a text asking please answer the door, we need to talk about a few things?. He replied im in bed and would give me a ring later, there was a few things he wanted to talk to me about. I waited around for about 1hour hoping that he would just talk to me, nothing, so i gave up. I got back home and recieved a text saying that he didnt appreciate me hanging around his house and that i should make an appointment and he had been told that i wanted him out.

To be honest i dont think i do want him in now but that wasnt my intention when i went to see him. I was feeling "better the devil you know" and after all he was already in. But now he wont talk to me. I was in no way threatning as im not that type of person.

Any advice at all on my next course of acttion. im recieving advice saying get him out straight away from alot of people, especially his previous landlady.

Sorry for long winded message.

In life, we may learn the easy way, the hard way or not at all, for every given situation.
If we don't learn, then we will keep getting the same experiences, until we do learn or until we die.

There are a number of tools that were available to you to have avoided this situation but you chose not to avail yourself of these.

Exactly why you chose to operate in the way you have is unknown, but I hope you learn from this experience and also, know that thousands of people over time have made the same mistake and paid the price.
In future, you can tap into those "lessons learned" and ensure you don't suffer again in this or other ways.

As it stands, if your tenant is still paying his rent, I would send a notice of inspection round to assess the inside of the property.
Go with a witness (preferably a person of good standing, like a doctor, lawyer, accountant, etc).
If the property is in good condition, then you will have no basis in which to take any action if the rent is also being paid as required.

The tenant can still refuse to let you in even after you have sent them a valid notice of inspection, in which case you will have to grind it out until he does something, like not pay rent or cause other issues.

I hope things work out for you.