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Kittaycat
30-01-2010, 20:13 PM
I moved into my rented property in September on an AST. Within one week I discovered there were several major issues with the property which weren't apparent when I moved in. (1), the washing machine leaked. (2) A number of the radiators were blocked. (3) The oven didn't work. Also, there was pest infestation - myself and my son had bites all over us (4). I contacted the landlord regarding these matters - he was very disbelieving and unsympathetic but said he would send someone round to check issues 1-3. He flatly denied any responsibility for (4). I waited a week but at no time was contacted by the landlord regarding a time and date for the repairman to come round - when I phoned the landlord after one week he said that someone had called but I was out. To cut a long story short I paid for someone to repair washing machine, sort out the radiators. I kept the receipts. Landlord (after 3 weeks) replaced the oven (I used my own microwave meanwhile). I also arranged for Pest Control to come round and spray the place - they were appalled and had to remove the carpets and the bedding - I had to move out for three days - I did take photographic evidence. The landlord refused to supply and replacement carpeting and bedding. I bought my own beds but of course have not replaced the carpets.
Since October I have been trying to contact the Landlord to sort out the receipts and other matters - for example there is no gas safety certificate and there are other repair issues that I have report to him in writing, provided quotes, and paid for myself.
At no time has he replied to me. His 'agent' (his brother) phoned twice explaining that my Landlord was out of the country but he didn't believe that there was anything wrong with the property. He had a rather unpleasant tone and I explained to him that I would in future only communicate in writing - I subsequently heard nothing further from him.
In January I got fed up with paying the rent into the L/Lord's a/c as my expenditure on repairs was running into the equivalent of two months' rent. I set aside the money in a separate account explaining and wrote to him explaining this. I also wrote saying that when the tenancy was up (in early March) I intended to leave.
Last week I received an email from the L/lord explaining he was back in the country and wished to carry out a property inspection this weekend. I explained that I was going away, could we rearrange. He said he was coming round anyway and he had a right to enter my property.
I have subsequently changed the locks (I'm at a friend's until tomorrow evening when I return). Am I within my rights? What should I do next? I wish to leave but should I pay him the rent when he has cost me the equivalent of at least the last two months if not more. This doesn't include the aggravation, upset and anxiety I have gone through.

Pobinr
30-01-2010, 21:03 PM
Thanks to landlords like this bad landlord, the law is tough on landlords sometimes making life difficult for decent landlords with bad tenants. Report him having no gas safety certificate to the local authority.
I think you have a strong case if this came to court to walk away from this tenancy without the landlord succeeding in gaining costs from you. Meantime withhold the rent until these things are remedied.
Finally has he registered your deposit ?

westminster
30-01-2010, 22:15 PM
Yes, it's okay to replace the locks, so long as you reinstate the original locks (the LL's property) before the end of the tenancy. LL has no right of access without your consent or a court order.

There is a procedure for arranging repairs yourself and deducting the cost from the rent (when LL fails to take action) - see link below. You mention sending quotes so it's possible you have inadvertently followed it. You could also have contacted the environmental health officer at the council regarding the lack of heating & pest infestation (though if it was bed bugs I believe this is a slightly contentious area).

If you have evidence of everything you did (e.g. proof of posting letters to landlord or at least copies of the letters) and of the disrepair itself, then if this ended up before deposit scheme adjudication or a court, there's a good chance you wouldn't be held liable for the rent arrears. (Note that it's possible you are liable for repair of kitchen appliances under the terms of your tenancy agreement, so you need to check this).

Request the gas safety certificate in writing and if LL fails to provide it, report to the Health & Safety Executive.

Only withhold rent to the value of the money you've spent.

http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/repairs_and_bad_conditions/repairs_in_private_lets
And click header entitled "tenants doing repairs"

Kittaycat
31-01-2010, 14:21 PM
Thanks for that information - I intended to follow the Shelter procedure as indicated in the link.
I also did contact the environmental health department back in October and probably should have pursued it more forcefully - basically the Officer cancelled an appointment to come round twice and eventually (after me phoning up loads of times)sent off a letter to the landlord (I have a copy). By that stage I had paid for the repairs myself and as I work was disheartened to think of staying in yet again when no-one turns up.
Thanks for the suggestion of contacting the Health and Safety Executive regarding the gas safety certificate - I will certainly do that immediately.
The landlord does have the money in a deposit scheme so I will bear that in mind.

Kittaycat
05-02-2010, 09:43 AM
I have just received a letter from my Landlord - all very apologetic - saying that he didn't know about the repairs etc. etc. that he had been out of the country etc. and could he meet at my convenience.

Obviously I am willing to meet because I want this sorted out. I am hoping to come to a reasonable agreement with him and propose to do the following:

1. Write to him with a range of suitable times and dates for him to come round and carry out a property inspection.
2. Have a witness at the property with me.
3. Have the paperwork - a list of what was not working and when, plus copies of all my attempts to contact him (these were by email and went unanswered for months) plus the schedule of repairs I carried out at my own expense.
4. In this letter I will also request (once again!) that he provides proof of the gas safety certificate.

Is there anything else I should add? How can I show that I put the two months rent aside in my bank account? (should I print off my bank statement - it's not something I particularly want him to be privy to).

The main thing is - I don't want to be out of pocket here. I can probably show that I have spent in excess of two months' rent from various repair receipts. Although I roughly followed the Shelter procedures I did not do this for every single repair (for example the pest control) but I want my deposit back and do not wish him to feel that he has a chance to sue me for the unpaid rent after I leave. (NB AST 5th March. Haven't got a notice yet but I certainly wish to leave)

Does anyone have any further advice or tips? Anything would be appreciated!

Kittaycat
09-02-2010, 15:57 PM
Can anyone advise me on this please?

I have written to my landlord (as in previous post) outlining my concerns and explaining I would like to meet with him - and indicating several possible dates.

However, I have heard nothing back from him yet - it has been almost a week and I am getting concerned.

My AST runs out on 05/03 and he hasn't issued me with a s.21 or other notice (on ground 8?) as I have two months unpaid rent now because of the disrepair. I have followed the shelter protocol as far as I could (provided quotes, and then had the work done by myself when I hadn't heard anything after about 2 weeks).

I am getting a bit worried as to his intentions - I don't want to move out on the 5th as the place I am going to won't be ready until the end of the month. Any advice as to what I should/should not do?

Kittaycat
10-02-2010, 10:48 AM
My landlord came round unexpectedly yesterday evening, and although I would have preferred to have had someone with me (as a witness) I agreed to let him in to carry out a property inspection.

Basically, he accused me of causing damage to the property by removing the beds and carpet back in October when I had the place sprayed for pests: he said that I had brought the pests in with me when I moved in! The pest bites started the weekend after I moved into the property but I wasn’t able to get the place sprayed for a couple of weeks because I was trying to follow the correct ‘procedure’ by attempting to contact the landlord, waiting for a response etc.

He also refused to acknowledge responsibility for the other repairs, again saying that I had caused the ‘damage’ (leaky washing machine, blocked radiators as well as some other minor repairs such as faulty wiring to a light ) despite this being towards the start of the tenancy. Although I had tried to contact him and received no reply he said I was being unreasonable by having work completed without his permission etc.

He now says that if I withhold any money (equivalent roughly to two months rent) he will not only NOT return my deposit (which he said he won’t return anyway because I hadn’t replaced the carpets) but that he will also sue me for the two months ‘outstanding’ rent!

I am really worried now but also really angry after all the upset I went through.

What shld be my next move? Am wondering whether I should:

(1) – pay the money and then attempt to get compensation through the courts? How would I do this? Small claims? - any likelihood of succeeding? - Or:

(2) – not pay, stand firm, gather my evidence and claim for my deposit back plus compensation (would be just under 5k) in the small claims court?

Also – I didn’t mention the issue of the gas safety certificate as I was waiting for him to provide it (I have requested it in writing several times) but he didn’t. Can I use this as added evidence?

westminster
10-02-2010, 12:45 PM
My landlord came round unexpectedly yesterday evening, and although I would have preferred to have had someone with me (as a witness) I agreed to let him in to carry out a property inspection.

Basically, he accused me of causing damage to the property by removing the beds and carpet back in October when I had the place sprayed for pests: he said that I had brought the pests in with me when I moved in! The pest bites started the weekend after I moved into the property but I wasn’t able to get the place sprayed for a couple of weeks because I was trying to follow the correct ‘procedure’ by attempting to contact the landlord, waiting for a response etc.
What particular pests were they? And why did the pest control take the carpets away?




What shld be my next move? Am wondering whether I should:

(1) – pay the money and then attempt to get compensation through the courts? How would I do this? Small claims? - any likelihood of succeeding? - Or:

(2) – not pay, stand firm, gather my evidence and claim for my deposit back plus compensation (would be just under 5k) in the small claims court?
If by 'compensation' you mean the 3x deposit penalty for non-compliance with deposit protection, this is not a straightforward 'small claim' and it would be advisable to seek specialist legal advice. See
http://painsmith.wordpress.com/2009/05/21/proper-place-for-tds-claims/
Although some people have successfully pursued such claims as a litigant-in-person e.g.
http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=22208
it would be irresponsible to recommend it because of the potential risks (which should be apparent from both links).

Note that, if the deposit is not protected, LL cannot serve you with a s.21 notice. It's the other sanction for non-compliance. LL can still serve you with a s.8 notice on grounds of 'unpaid rent' (but you appear to have the necessary evidence that it has been lawfully withheld).

Assuming LL doesn't claim against you first, a safer option would be to issue a claim against LL for return of the deposit only (when the tenancy ends), plus possibly compensation for the disrepair if you think that would be appropriate. He will then counterclaim for damage and unpaid rent. You have evidence showing the valid reasons for the unpaid rent, your attempts to contact LL, failure by LL to carry out repairs (N.B. which may not include electrical appliances), pest control's report on the infestation etc.

Yes, you can also mention in your witness statement that LL did not provide a gas safety certificate, but it's not grounds for any compensation as such when you haven't suffered any loss as a consequence (it's for HSE to prosecute LL if appropriate) but it does show that LL is irresponsible. You can also state that deposit wasn't protected. All adds up to a LL who isn't complying with his statutory duties; the court will not look favourably on such behaviour, and it will serve to undermine his credibility as a witness, if, say, he falsely claims he made lots of attempts to send people round to make repairs.

I think you have a reasonably good chance of winning and getting the deposit back, assuming you have the necessary evidence to support your claim and defence.


Also – I didn’t mention the issue of the gas safety certificate as I was waiting for him to provide it (I have requested it in writing several times) but he didn’t. Can I use this as added evidence?
Report to HSE, as previously advised.

westminster
10-02-2010, 12:51 PM
The case law which established the procedure for writing to LL repeatedly, allowing reasonable time, providing quotes, etc before carrying out repairs yourself and withholding the sum from rent (as described on the Shelter website) is
Lee-Parker v Izzet (1971)
This is the case you should refer to when defending your actions.

BTW, did you, after carrying out the repairs, then write a final letter to landlord stating that repair cost £x and you would therefore be withholding £x rent?

jeffrey
10-02-2010, 13:00 PM
Citation: Lee-Parker v. Izzet (No. 2) [1972] 2 All ER 800, [1972] 1 WLR 775, 23 P & CR 301, 116 Sol Jo 446,

westminster
10-02-2010, 13:24 PM
Citation: Lee-Parker v. Izzet (No. 2) [1972] 2 All ER 800, [1972] 1 WLR 775, 23 P & CR 301, 116 Sol Jo 446,
This one seems to be about a different issue? e.g. "In that case, there was an agreement for the sale of a house “subject to the purchaser obtaining a satisfactory mortgage”. Mr Justice Goulding held that this was a condition precedent to the existence of a binding contract and that it was void for uncertainty."

It's the 1971 case which is about withholding rent. See p77 of this Law Commission report, where it is cited.
http://www.official-documents.gov.uk/document/cm69/6946/6946.pdf

jeffrey
10-02-2010, 14:18 PM
OK. Try Lee-Parker v Izzet [1971] 1 WLR 1688.

westminster
10-02-2010, 14:44 PM
OK. Try Lee-Parker v Izzet [1971] 1 WLR 1688.
Which is what I said in the first place, in #9 :rolleyes:

Kittaycat
10-02-2010, 15:00 PM
Westminster thank you for your advice.

The pest control people were from my local council - they had to remove the carpet because of extensive damage through bedbugs. They also had to remove the beds which I replaced at my own expense because the landlord did not reply and I couldn't be without beds for days on end.

I am thinking that I may pay the rent owing and issue a claim afterwards eg if I don't get the deposit back. Would I be able to claim for the stress of it all do you think?

jeffrey
10-02-2010, 15:49 PM
Which is what I said in the first place, in #9.
Yes, without the citation.

Kittaycat
10-02-2010, 16:06 PM
I have just received an email from the landlord with 2 notices attached.

(1) is a section 21 dated 5th Feb and requiring possession after 5th April. That's ok by me.

(2) is a section 8 seeking possession grounds 8,10,11 and 12. It states that rent has been unpaid (true) and that that reasonable permission to enter the property has been refused (not true!).

It says that Court proceedings will not begin until after 22nd Feb 2010.
This is not ok by me. Isn't this a bit soon?
Any advice on what to do next?

westminster
10-02-2010, 16:44 PM
Westminster thank you for your advice.

The pest control people were from my local council - they had to remove the carpet because of extensive damage through bedbugs. They also had to remove the beds which I replaced at my own expense because the landlord did not reply and I couldn't be without beds for days on end.

I am thinking that I may pay the rent owing and issue a claim afterwards eg if I don't get the deposit back. Would I be able to claim for the stress of it all do you think?
If you pay the withheld rent and get the deposit back, you're still out of pocket for all the repairs you were forced to make. So it doesn't make a huge amount of sense to pay the withheld rent then claim it back, but I can understand why you'd want to as it's an uncomfortable situation and not 100% black and white (things never are). No harm in claiming some compensation for the stress, hassle and inconvenience of LL's inaction and having to organize repairs yourself, and having to live in an infested property for two weeks, whatever you think is fair. If you're not planning to take the beds with you when you move, claim for those too.

westminster
10-02-2010, 17:19 PM
I have just received an email from the landlord with 2 notices attached.

(1) is a section 21 dated 5th Feb and requiring possession after 5th April. That's ok by me.
So is the deposit protected or not? Because if not this notice is invalid.


(2) is a section 8 seeking possession grounds 8,10,11 and 12. It states that rent has been unpaid (true) and that that reasonable permission to enter the property has been refused (not true!).

It says that Court proceedings will not begin until after 22nd Feb 2010.
This is not ok by me. Isn't this a bit soon?
Any advice on what to do next?

Ground 8 is about owing 2 months rent at least
Ground 10 & 11 are about persistent late payment of rent
Ground 12 is about breaking one of the terms of the contract (i.e. I presume your contract says you have to allow access at reasonable notice) - you don't need to worry about this one, especially as it's untrue.

The s.8 procedure is faster than s.21 (because s.8 only gives 14 days but s.21 gives 2 months) but that's just when the notice expires. When it does, the LL can then apply for a court order for possession (i.e. begin the proceedings), and the hearing could be around a month after that. If he succeeds in obtaining a possession order, and you still don't move out, then he'd have to wait to get a bailiff to enforce the order. So all in all even with s.8 proceedings it could take a couple of months from now to that point, maybe longer.

You have two choices: pay up (then claim against LL at a later date) or not. Either way, if LL proceeds to apply for a possession order after the s.8 notice expires, you should go to the hearing and argue your case, with all the evidence showing that the rent has (or had) been lawfully withheld, and evidence of the disrepair (and if LL waits and uses s.21 route instead he would have to show evidence that he'd protected deposit).

westminster
10-02-2010, 17:27 PM
Yes, without the citation.
So even though I got the parties and year right, and you 'corrected' me with the wrong case, and I pointed out the correct case with an example from a Law Commission Report which gives the full citation* - I'm still wrong?

Okay. Consider me fully corrected.

*Lee-Parker v Izzet [1971] 1 WLR 1688

jeffrey
10-02-2010, 17:31 PM
No, you're right but you did not provide (in your post) the citation of the case.
It's like "The truth..and nothing but the truth', omitting 'the whole truth'!

westminster
10-02-2010, 18:17 PM
No, you're right but you did not provide (in your post) the citation of the case.
It's like "The truth..and nothing but the truth', omitting 'the whole truth'!
I left it off deliberately, because it is not expected that a litigant-in-person in the small claims track would adhere to such legal niceties; the information provided was wholly adequate for Kittaycat's purposes, intelligible to a layperson therefore more likely to be remembered and actually used, and the court would have no difficulty locating Lee-Parker v Izzet [1971] even sans curlicues (there appears to be no more than one legal battle between these particular parties per year).

westminster
10-02-2010, 18:42 PM
@kittaycat, Another thing occurred to me, if you're worried about getting a CCJ against your name; as long as you pay off the debt within a certain time (30 days, I think) and apply to have this fact registered*, then it won't count against you as a black mark on your credit rating.

*Don't know details of how/where you do this, so not super-helpful I know, but easy to find out from google.

jeffrey
10-02-2010, 18:45 PM
@kittaycat, Another thing occurred to me, if you're worried about getting a CCJ against your name; as long as you pay off the debt within a certain time (30 days, I think) and apply to have this fact registered*, then it won't count against you as a black mark on your credit rating.

*Don't know details of how/where you do this, so not super-helpful I know, but easy to find out from google.
Simply:
a. produce (to relevant County Court) evidence of full payment; and
b. obtain a Certificate of Satisfaction.

Perplexed
10-02-2010, 18:53 PM
Just out of curiosity, is there an inventory relating to this tenancy?

Perplexed
10-02-2010, 19:05 PM
There ya go, you mention the inventory and the OP suddenly goes quiet. :p

westminster
10-02-2010, 19:13 PM
OP's not online, but I'm guessing there's no inventory (given there's no gas safety certificate and probably no deposit protection, and the place was infested with bedbugs, etc...). Strangely competent when it comes to serving notices, though, which suggests to me a cynical, exploitative landlord. (I'm a LL, BTW, not a bitter tenant).

westminster
10-02-2010, 19:15 PM
Simply:
a. produce (to relevant County Court) evidence of full payment; and
b. obtain a Certificate of Satisfaction.
Thank you, Jeffrey :) Clearly, this is what Mick Jagger needed.

jeffrey
10-02-2010, 19:41 PM
Thank you, Jeffrey. Clearly, this is what Mick Jagger needed.
Well he tried
And he tried
And he tried
And he tried
But he couldn't get no.

westminster
10-02-2010, 19:51 PM
Well he tried
And he tried
And he tried
And he tried
But he couldn't get no.
And yet all he had to do was produce evidence of full payment to the relevant county court.

Sad, really.:(

Kittaycat
10-02-2010, 19:55 PM
FYI Perplexed -

yes an inventory was done when I signed for tenancy, at the apartment with the landlord present. He took it 'for his records' and said I would receive a copy. This, like the gas safety certificate that I continually have requested over the past 5 months, I have yet to receive.

I must also point out that when I signed the inventory everything, on the surface, looked okay: paintwork etc. It was really only on the second or third day when I tried to use the washing machine, the baking part of the oven, change a light, switch on the radiators, that I started to realise that the place had problems. And that the landlord was less than responsive.

westminster
10-02-2010, 20:00 PM
@kittaycat, is the deposit protected, and what does it say about anyone being responsible electrical appliances in the tenancy agreement?

Kittaycat
10-02-2010, 20:05 PM
Tenancy agreement states that the tenant is responsible I think. I will go and check. I can understand this if something breaks down after the first few weeks or so that the tenant should be responsbile/contribute to repairs (if not under warantee). But after the first day, the first time it is used? How can you be sure when you first get a place - switch everything on, test the appliances before you sign the tenancy agreement?

Kittaycat
10-02-2010, 20:33 PM
I have checked my tenancy agreement and it is very oddly worded it says that the tenant is responsible for the electrics but the L/l for the workings.

jeffrey
11-02-2010, 10:59 AM
I have checked my tenancy agreement and it is very oddly worded it says that the tenant is responsible for the electrics but the L/l for the workings.
Irrelevant. L is responsible for all mains installations, by operation of law: s.11 of LTA 1985.

Perplexed
11-02-2010, 12:10 PM
Irrelevant. L is responsible for all mains installations, by operation of law: s.11 of LTA 1985.

Not the washing machine though.

jeffrey
11-02-2010, 12:14 PM
Not the washing machine though.
I agree. That's apparatus, not installation, so it's outside the scope of s.11.

Kittaycat
11-02-2010, 12:18 PM
Thanks Jeffrey, sometimes the legal wording can be arcane in these documents.

Have been sorting through all my documents, particularly the ones from pest control. It does state that the infestation was 'deep' ie not brought into the property by myself etc., unlike the allegation of L/l. The Pest Control contractor also left contact details saying that he would be happy to make a statement at any time to the effect that the property was uninhabitable for a
certain period of time and that certain items -beds/carpets etc - needed to be removed permanently.

I am assuming that because the L/lord has not returned the inventory and in light of the removal of the carpets etc he will be attempting to contest the return of the deposit? If this is so, I would then apply to the relevant deposit scheme it is (allegedly) registered under?

Kittaycat
11-02-2010, 12:42 PM
Re Washing Machine outside the scope of s.11 does this mean then that I was responsible for its repair? Even though I notified the landlord that it was not functioning properly three days after moving in?

jeffrey
11-02-2010, 12:49 PM
Re Washing Machine outside the scope of s.11 does this mean then that I was responsible for its repair? Even though I notified the landlord that it was not functioning properly three days after moving in?
This depends on L's obligations in the Letting Agreement (contract) and the Inventory, not on s.11.

Perplexed
11-02-2010, 12:52 PM
This depends on L's obligations in the Letting Agreement (contract) and the Inventory, not on s.11.

Exactly. Therefore OP would be well advised to check what is stated in the paperwork in relation to this.

Kittaycat
11-02-2010, 13:01 PM
These appear to be the relevant sections under 'Landlord Obligations':

3.1.2 to keep in repair and proper working order the installation in the said Premises for the supply of water gas and electricity and the sanitation (including basins sinks baths and sanitary convenience but not the fixtures and appliances for making use of the supply of water gas electricity) and for ensuring that all gas appliances within the Premises are annually certified by a CORGI registered engineer in accordance with The Gas Safety (Installation and Use ) Regulations 1994 and for space heating or heating water

3.1.4 save insofar as in the Tenant’s responsibility under this Agreement to keep the Property and each and every part thereof including all conduits and conducting media for drainage and the supply of services and also all fixtures furniture and effects in the Property serviced and in good repair throughout the Term and in particular to repair and faulty electrical appliances


I think however that the Landlord may be obliged to be responsible for the washing machine - not under L&Ts.11 - but possibly under 'Unfair Tenancy Terms' (OFT directive, I think) if the tenancy agreement was to state that he was not... I have been reading 3.1.2 and 4 above and find their wording a bit oblique so if anyone can translate I'd be very grateful!

Perplexed
11-02-2010, 13:03 PM
TA seems to indicate T is responsible for washing mnachine repairs.

Whether or not this would stick in court is something Jeffrey might enlighten us on.

jeffrey
11-02-2010, 13:33 PM
TA seems to indicate T is responsible for washing mnachine repairs.
Where? Clause 3.1.4 is L's obligation, you know. It excludes only things that are as in the Tenant’s responsibility under this Agreement.

Kittaycat
11-02-2010, 13:51 PM
In my tenancy agreement under Tenant's Obligations (there are many but am not going to quote all here) the most relevant would appear to be that the tenant has the obligation:

"2.6 To keep the Contents listed in the inventory in good repair and condition (reasonable wear and tear excepted) and to ensure all electrical gas and other appliances including the burglar alarm system and any others listed in the inventory and kept in good working order and to pay for immediate replacement of any Contents or parts thereof which have become lost or defective through negligence or ill treatment by the Tenant or any invitee of the Tenant so as to be unusable with others of similar value and appearance and to replace all light bulbs and electrical fuses which become defective "

Only problem is that:
1. Landlord did not return the signed inventory to me (despite requests - documented in writing - emails)

However: I do have records of my repeated requests (emails) for L/l to address repairs issue. In fact under the agreement the Tenant's obligations are to:

"2.18 To notify the Landlord forthwith in writing of any defect in the Premises other than such as the Tenant is liable to remedy under clause 2.6 above as soon as is practicable after such a defect comes to the notice of the Tenant"

I presume that my emails - and I have a stack of them about all relevant items - are sufficient evidence for this?
I think I may very well have a good case for challenging the non payment of rent in court. It may well mean I should take legal advice to present my case - what do people think?
What would be the chances of getting the deposit back? I can't see L/l handing it over without a fuss.

jeffrey
11-02-2010, 14:34 PM
to ensure all electrical gas and other appliances including the burglar alarm system and any others listed in the inventory and** kept in good working order

Line 1 says 'all...appliances', so T's obligation ('and to ensure..kept in working order') covers all. The inventory relates only to 'any others listed'.
** Does this word read/mean 'are'?

Kittaycat
11-02-2010, 14:42 PM
In the source itself - the orginal Tenancy Agreement document - it appears as 'and'. Whether this is deliberate, I don't know. It would make more sense for it to be 'are'.
There are a few other similar errors/typos throughout the agreement.

Kittaycat
11-02-2010, 14:55 PM
I have also noticed, that the tenant is obliged:
2.22 In the event of loss or damage by fire theft impact or other causes to immediately inform the Landlord or the Landlords agent and to give details thereof to enable the Landlord to make a claim to his insurers

These 'other causes' could they refer to pest infestation?

So by my reasoning the L/l had no excuse for not replacing the carpet which was taken away by Pest Control or the beds as he could have legitimately provided the documentation from Pest Control to the insurance company. As it was, he ignored my letters on this subject as well as one from a solicitor on the matter!

jeffrey
11-02-2010, 15:07 PM
Yes, 'other causes' could include pests. The words clearly mean something different from fire/theft/impact but that causes loss/damage.

Kittaycat
11-02-2010, 15:17 PM
Many thanks for that information.
I have decided that I will probably exit the property by the end of this month as I am just so fed up with it all. I have somewhere to stay for the next few months until I am sorted out. ( I own a property which I have rented out - but although I can issue a s.21 or s.8 (1) I did have an understanding with my tenants that I would not require the property back before the summer, so I don't want to go back on that).

I basically haven't paid the rent for the last three months - I feel with the repairs and the stress it has caused I have had good reason not to! I have accumulated a mass of evidence, I believe to back this up.

I am quite happy to defend myself/issue a counter claim regarding the 'unpaid rent'. I also want the deposit back.However if I just leave, and return the keys (by registered post - L/l lives in the Midlands, property is in London) what is likely to happen?

havensRus
12-02-2010, 08:11 AM
I basically haven't paid the rent for the last three months - I feel with the repairs and the stress it has caused I have had good reason not to! I have accumulated a mass of evidence, I believe to back this up.


You could make copies of all the evidence, outline the costs that you have incurred (invoice style), and send to the LL, with an offer of settlement of shortfall (if any).



I am quite happy to defend myself/issue a counter claim regarding the 'unpaid rent'. I also want the deposit back.However if I just leave, and return the keys (by registered post - L/l lives in the Midlands, property is in London) what is likely to happen?

Definitely send keys by registered post.
The LL will likely continue with the S8 proceedings based on rent arrears, and if that's the case, you have the info you need to present your defence in court. Just make sure you attend the hearing, else judgement will be given against you.

Good luck.

Kittaycat
12-02-2010, 09:26 AM
Many thanks for that information havensRus.

I think that's what I will do - write to Landlord with invoices + offer (if any). If I don't get a reasonable reply I will certainly gather together all the evidence for court.

Question - all the stress and wasted time (eg measuring rooms and obtaining 3 quotes for carpets in my own time, sent to L/l and never heard anything back; waiting in for tradespeople who never arrived on two occasions) - would anyone know how much I should estimate that at in my invoice to L.l?

I think I saw somewhere that there was a standard hourly calculation for this that legal bodies use? I work part time, professional job, so have had to take annual leave + unpaid leave for some of this running around.

Thanks again for all the advice given - will update on progress of case.

Kittaycat
12-02-2010, 13:16 PM
I have just received an email from L/l stating that because I will be moving in the next month he requires access to show potential tenants around as stipulated in the Tenancy agreement:

2.17 To permit the Landlord or his agent at reasonable hours in the daytime to enter the Premises during the last two months of the term with prospective Tenants and at any time with the prospective purchasers of the Landlords interest in the Premises

Now when I signed the T/A I had no problem with this. However in light of the subsequent behaviour of L/l I do have very real concerns.

Firstly - I have changed the locks (did not inform L/l) because he indicated that he had the 'right' to enter the property as he saw fit, without my consent (see early posts for full details) and unreasonably in my opinion.

Whilst intending to change the locks back on the day I leave I have no wish to do so beforehand because I do not trust the L/l not to enter the place at will, during the day, when I am out.

What to do about this?

jeffrey
12-02-2010, 13:23 PM
Refuse on grounds that you have revoked your consent, object to L's interference with your home, and the explicit obligation on L re 'Quiet enjoyment'.

Kittaycat
12-02-2010, 13:45 PM
Thanks Jeffrey for your advice - I was thinking of emailing L/l back saying something like that. I did half think of adding that were he to arrange with me date and time when I would be at home, it would be okay. But I would be very uneasy being on my own with landlord and 'prospective' tenant or whoever.

My only problem is that I don't want to provide L/l with any ammunition to suggest that I am being 'unreasonable'.

Kittaycat
15-02-2010, 10:03 AM
Help - advice please!!!!

L/Lord emailed this morning asking whether there was 'any possibility to do the work over half term'? He refers to the numerous repair jobs, big and small which he has ignored for the past 5 months!

What should my response be? Firstly, I don't want him entering the place when I am out (I have changed the locks without his knowledge - see previous posts - will change it back when I move out), but secondly I don't want to appear 'unreasonable' as if I am making it difficult to assess what needs to be done and access the place. I had intended to go away for half term with my son - to get some well earned rest and stay somewhere which is at least half decent.

Kittaycat
16-02-2010, 09:34 AM
As an update: I was in my property yesterday evening (around 7pm) alone with son. The doorbell rang - before I could answer it I heard someone attempting to turn a key in the lock - I didn't answer - and this was soon followed by heavy hammering on the door. I believe it may have been my L/l.

Suspicions confirmed in that I received email from L/l saying that he had 'called round' yesterday evening and because of non-access and my unreasonable attitude (I emailed yesterday explaining that am available next week by arrangement but am going away for this week as it is half-term) he was looking to take legal action to obtain an injunction to access the property.

I am sick of this harassment - he did not even offer the courtesey of a reply for the first 4 months after I moved in when I contacted him about serious repair issues - can anyone advise me what to do next?

mind the gap
16-02-2010, 11:38 AM
As an update: I was in my property yesterday evening (around 7pm) alone with son. The doorbell rang - before I could answer it I heard someone attempting to turn a key in the lock - I didn't answer - and this was soon followed by heavy hammering on the door. I believe it may have been my L/l.

Suspicions confirmed in that I received email from L/l saying that he had 'called round' yesterday evening and because of non-access and my unreasonable attitude (I emailed yesterday explaining that am available next week by arrangement but am going away for this week as it is half-term) he was looking to take legal action to obtain an injunction to access the property.

I am sick of this harassment - he did not even offer the courtesey of a reply for the first 4 months after I moved in when I contacted him about serious repair issues - can anyone advise me what to do next?

'A legal injunction' sounds frightening and I do not think it is the correct term anyway. Whatever the LL threatens you with, he would find it extremely difficult to get urgent legal authorisation to access your home. He or the agent would need to apply for a court order to enable them to enforce any clause in your contract allowing access for whatever reason (other than life and death emergencies such as a gas leak , flood or fire, in which case they could probably just break down the door - but have to justify that afterwards to a court if need be). Court orders take weeks, if not months - you will be gone by then. You could point this out to the agent (who clearly does not have a clue) or you could simply ask him to stop harassing you and that you think that in the circumstances, having waited so long for any repsonse to your request for repairs, you have decided to put up with the disrepair until you move out. He can do sort out the repairs then.

Kittaycat
16-02-2010, 11:44 AM
Thanks for your advice - will email this as my reply.
L/l doesn't have an agent - I would sometimes receive an email from his brother who would call himself his agent, but there was nothing in the T.A. about this.:rolleyes:

mind the gap
16-02-2010, 11:49 AM
Thanks for your advice - will email this as my reply.
L/l doesn't have an agent - I would sometimes receive an email from his brother who would call himself his agent, but there was nothing in the T.A. about this.

In that case, just deal directly with your LL, in writing, and request that if he needs to contact you again he should do so in writing. Make it clear that under no circumstances should he or any tradesmen access your home in your absence.

Keep a copy of all correspondence.

Try to enjoy your half-term:)

Kittaycat
16-02-2010, 12:07 PM
Mind the gap thanks for reply just one more quick question:

When you say in writing do you mean letter with proof of posting? I

Does it matter whether it's email (as long as I can show through a print out and don't delete the sent items) or is it better to just write letters and have proof of posting every time?

mind the gap
16-02-2010, 12:18 PM
Mind the gap thanks for reply just one more quick question:

When you say in writing do you mean letter with proof of posting? I

Does it matter whether it's email (as long as I can show through a print out and don't delete the sent items) or is it better to just write letters and have proof of posting every time?

Letters are good because they are inherently more formal than emails - they help put a bit more distance between you. Ultimately it is a little easier to prove you sent them, as well. You may want to email him once today explaining your position re access, and saying that you will send him a copy of your email by post and that you would prefer him in future not to email, text or phone you.

Then stick to the postal service and get (free) certificate of postage for any letters you send him.

Good luck. Don't let him bully you.

Kittaycat
16-02-2010, 12:36 PM
Thanks will do.

Can now go off and forget this nightmare over half-term!:D