Are my two properties HMOs (or not)?

[Diversity]

Ok I have read up about HMO's but I am still unsure if this classification applies to me. So would like to get your views regarding this:

Property 1:
Has 3 rooms, 1 tenant per room = 3 tenants total (who are unrelated), one bath room, one kitchen + lounge in open plan arrangement. All working professionals in a well-to-do part of SW london (ie. not students or 'vulnerable' people). The flat is the top floor flat occupying just that floor - "Flat 3". Entrance is communal from ground-floor with a flight of stairs to the top with door to each flat of each respective floor. Flat 1 is the ground floor and basement. Flat 2 is the 1st floor. So can someone please clarify if the '3 or more stories' requirement applies to my flat.

Property 2:
Also has 3 rooms, , 1 tenant per room = 3 tenants total (who are unrelated) as in Property 1, but has two bathrooms and a separate kitchen and lounge. Also in the same part of London as Property 1. And again all are working professionals. The property is "Flat C" occupying 1st floor and Loft floor. The ground floor is where the front (unshared) entrance is leading up to the first floor. No rooms exist on the ground floor. So would this flat by considered on 2 floors? And does it count as an HMO?

Any help appreciated :)

[red40]

Property 1:
Has 3 rooms, 1 tenant per room = 3 tenants total (who are unrelated), one bath room, one kitchen + lounge in open plan arrangement. All working professionals in a well-to-do part of SW london (ie. not students or 'vulnerable' people). The flat is the top floor flat occupying just that floor - "Flat 3". Entrance is communal from ground-floor with a flight of stairs to the top with door to each flat of each respective floor. Flat 1 is the ground floor and basement. Flat 2 is the 1st floor. So can someone please clarify if the '3 or more stories' requirement applies to my flat.

Yes you have a HMO that meets the requirements of section 254(3) of the Housing Act 2004 by the sounds of it!


Property 2:
Also has 3 rooms, , 1 tenant per room = 3 tenants total (who are unrelated) as in Property 1, but has two bathrooms and a separate kitchen and lounge. Also in the same part of London as Property 1. And again all are working professionals. The property is "Flat C" occupying 1st floor and Loft floor. The ground floor is where the front (unshared) entrance is leading up to the first floor. No rooms exist on the ground floor. So would this flat by considered on 2 floors? And does it count as an HMO?

Ditto, same a property 1

I wont go into the ins and outs that you may have a HMO within a HMO, but from what you have described of the self contained flats they appear to meet the definitions given in the above section.

A HMO can be 1 storey high or any other number of storeys, within reason.

Hope that helps a little?

[Rodent1]

Also worth pointing out that anymore than 2 households sharing within a self contained unit is deemed a HMO.

A LICENSABLE HMO is 3 storey and 5 or more UNRELATED occupants (a family of 5+ can reside with no License applicable)

OP confusion seems to be arising from the misunderstanding that only licensable props are classed as HMO's.It should also be noted that 3 st 5 occ come under Mandatory licensing, but local council have the right to exercise extended licencing to pretty much any property they choose.

Further there are plenty of LL under the misconception that no license = no obligations to H&S and management issues ...this is incorrect, these LL should find out more about "management of HMO properties" legislation.

You may have a shock in store !

OP ..it sounds like they are certainly HMO's but prob not licensable ...call you local council and ask to speak to the HMO team get them out there to advise and get their comments in writing.

[Diversity]

Further there are plenty of LL under the misconception that no license = no obligations to H&S and management issues ...this is incorrect, these LL should find out more about "management of HMO properties" legislation.

You may have a shock in store !

Thanks for the replies guys. What is "H&S".. Housing? & Safety?


OP ..it sounds like they are certainly HMO's but prob not licensable ...call you local council and ask to speak to the HMO team get them out there to advise and get their comments in writing.

Ok, so my properties are HMO but do not fall under the mandatory licensing criteria. What particular attributes or factors would the local council HMO officer look at in order to make a decision whether to exercise extended licensing or not. I got the impression it was only properties that were kept in poor conditions that were their concern.

Any clarification on this would be appreciated

[tom999]

What is "H&S".. Housing? & Safety?
Health & Safety.


What particular attributes or factors would the local council HMO officer look at in order to make a decision whether to exercise extended licensing or not. I got the impression it was only properties that were kept in poor conditions that were their concern.
HMO licensing has more to do with type of property and occupants. Varous local authorities have different criteria and standards/regulations, so best advice is to get your local council's HMO officer to inspect and give correct advice, as Rodent has mentioned above.

Additional Info:
HMO's (http://www.communities.gov.uk/housing/rentingandletting/privaterenting/housesmultiple/)
Licensing guide for HMO's (http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/housing/pdf/322460.pdf)

[Telometer]

If you are in Westminister you will have to bring them up to standard with fire doors, mains fire alarms etc. etc. etc. Even though not mandatorially licensable.

[Diversity]

Thanks for the advice/info everyone :)

Is it a legal requirement to contact the council? What if one does nothing, which I assume is what LL's do if they are not in the mandatory category

[Rodent1]

Thanks for the advice/info everyone

Is it a legal requirement to contact the council? What if one does nothing, which I assume is what LL's do if they are not in the mandatory category

If one does nothing and there is a fire/injury etc at the property ...one may very seriously, and quickly, regret the fact that one has not been been taking on board the responsibilities of providing accom as a LL, one would be well advised to:

1.Re-consider his/her position on this.
2.Cover on's arse.

I speak to private sector housing on a regular basis, with regard to my portfolio, rules change quite regularly and it is the responsibilty of the LL to be up to date with current regs.


:rolleyes:

[Telometer]

Thanks for the advice/info everyone :)

Is it a legal requirement to contact the council? What if one does nothing, which I assume is what LL's do if they are not in the mandatory category

You completely misunderstand "mandatory" in this context.

It is the Council that is mandatorily required to licence all properties with 5 of more people. It is the Council that can choose to require properties with fewer people to be licensed too.

So in a counicl like Southwark or Lambeth, you have minimal responsibilities if you have fewer than 5 people.

In a council like Westminster (is that where you are? if so, bad luck) that has more stringent criteria than the Government's minimum standards, you are required to comply with the law. I suggest a word with your local EHO to establish your requirements.

[sparkie]

Ok, thanks guys.