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mattyg
21-03-2006, 14:32 PM
I reported the break in to the police last night and they sent a patrol round they took the cctv tape of the workman in my flat after breaking in. and took a statement. Today however i had a phone call from CID saying they have spoken to landlord and will not be taking it any further. as its a civil matter between LL and tenant

So in short its ok for the landlord or one of his workmen to force his way into your flat/house have a snoop around and as long as he didnt take anything its not illegal so should i go round to my LL house tonight force my way in and have a snoop around.

I cant believe that dodgy LL can get away with this because the police are too busy pulling young lads over because they have their front fog lights on.

Does anyone know if i have a right to have him charged or what my next step is. my Fiance of 5 yrs wont stay in the flat on her own anymore and has moved into her mothers house and my 11 yr old son has been asking what if the man comes back. I have lived in that flat for 10yrs its disgusting that you can be treated that way


thanks and sorry for the rant
matt

Jennifer_M
21-03-2006, 14:44 PM
I would change the locks.

mattyg
21-03-2006, 14:58 PM
hes not got a key unless you meen change them and say he did it(but thats not my style plus he would only deny it and its my word against his)

davidjohnbutton
21-03-2006, 16:24 PM
Was there a specific reason why the workman broke in? If you had previously refused entry and there was something which the landlord considered correctly or incorrectly as an emergency, then there is a right to break in depending on the urgency.

Your tale is a bit one-sided and I think there is more to this than meets the eye - lets have the full story eh?

As to your question about prosecution of the landord - yes, you can "lay an information" with the local magistrates who may decide to issue a summons - but lets face it, it went zero yards with the police - you would have to prove mens rea - the landlord has given a reason presumably to the police which they accepted OR has put his hand up and admitted a mistake and won't do it again - to be a harassment case there has to be a course of conduct - i.e. more than one occasion - so to committ an offence under this heading he would have to do something twice or more that constitutes harassment.

A civil remedy might be more successful - but as I said before, this depends on the circumstances of the break in.

Jennifer_M
21-03-2006, 16:28 PM
I'm a bit confused here, how did the workman enter the property without a key ?

shhhh
21-03-2006, 17:20 PM
http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=1979

Ericthelobster
21-03-2006, 19:24 PM
Mattyg - it would help if you posted updates all on the same thread without starting new ones - otherwise it makes it hard for anyone advising you to follow what's going on! :)

mattyg
22-03-2006, 17:05 PM
I'm a bit confused here, how did the workman enter the property without a key ?
The workman tried to crow bar the door open there is damage by the lock.
then he removed a couple of pieces of already cracked glass put his arm through the window and open the door.(The previous damage was as a result of the lock going knackered with my girlfriend and son inside called LL but got no reply so had to break in twisting of the door cracked the glass LL has never complained about this though)


Mattyg - it would help if you posted updates all on the same thread without starting new ones - otherwise it makes it hard for anyone advising you to follow what's going on!
Sorry about that I was a little pi**ed off at the time


Your tale is a bit one-sided and I think there is more to this than meets the eye - lets have the full story eh?

I understand that it may seem a little one sided but his actions came right out of the blue i believe i have been more than patient with regards to waiting nearly 3 yrs for the window in our bedroom to be replaced there is only a couple of thin wood boards and it gets mighty cold in there in the winter i have kept temp logs since last november in one instance it was
-8deg outside and -2 inside. Now after his behaviour i want the book thrown at him
I have spoken to the EHO who wrote to me saying they are a little busy right now and will phone soon.
I have also put it in writing to the HSE regarding the lack of Gas safety checks.

The LL said because he gave me 48hrs notice he could enter my home without my permission to do an inspection. However we had a surveyor attend the week before and he did an inspection. Two in as many weeks?
with regards to the inspection the workman came in through my front door walked up my stairs(I live over a shop with my front door round the back)
walked down the hall poked his head into the kitchen the bathroom the toilet then read the note i had left for the LL on my living room door and left he couldnt do an inspection without checking the livingroom and both bedrooms?

pms
22-03-2006, 21:05 PM
Matty g: I've taken the time to read your postings and although some landlords on here have implied that what you say is a little one-sided I tend to disagree with them.There are always two sides to each story so I'm going to make a few points:

1) You say that you have been waiting 3 years for a window to be repaired.What kind of notice have you given him and was it in writing.To simplify matters if you have given notice,the law.s11 (L&T Act 1985) puts an obligation on a landlord to carry out repairs in a reasonable time.On the other hand the Landlord would not be in breach of S11 if he had no notice or had not been given reasonable time to remedy the defect.In this instance a CCJ would in most cases rule in your favour provided that you have given notice with the emphasis being on "reasonable time".

2) Provided your Landlord has given you a least 24hours notice to carry out an inspection then Im afraid he is not breaking the law.However he can not just walk in or use a key as this then borders onto other laws(you would have to invite him in and I dont care what the other landlords say).In this instance he would be in breach of the tenancy as you are allowed to have peaceful enjoyment of the premises.The law also protects you from harrasement and of course there is your human rights.If he changed the locks and you could not get in then that would be "classed as an illegal evection" from which you are protected by law.There is also grounds for "tresspass" which im not going into as the law here is complicated.Technically he can't tresspass on his own property but if he walks into the property when you have a valid tenancy agreement then you have a right to remove him using"reasonable force".A question here to Landlords"What would you do if you were watching t.v and your tenant came in and sat on your leather sofa" no doubt you would throw him out.So whats good for the goose is good for the gander.

3) What I can't understand is why you have allowed this to go on for so long.Why have you not taken legal advice.If you are being threatened or intimadated then you have a case.Also a point I will make there are some very good landlords out there and equally some very bad ones.What you have to remember that your rights in the private sector are limited and as I previously stated in your case the legal route may be the best one.

Energise
22-03-2006, 21:12 PM
A question here to Landlords"What would you do if you were watching t.v and your tenant came in and sat on your leather sofa"

I would wonder where the hell the leather sofa came from :eek:

pms
22-03-2006, 21:21 PM
I would wonder where the hell the leather sofa came from :eek:

Nice one energise:p

mattyg
23-03-2006, 14:22 PM
thanks pms for your comments and your time.

I noticed the window was broken at 3.30 in the morning when i had come back from a night out so at 3.30 am i was doing emergancy repairs instead of waking up the landlord(wish i had woken him now) and i phoned him the next day. he then sent someone round within a week to give a quote then nothing for about 40 weeks which i then got the letter regarding arrears(there are no arrears) i still have the letter.

with regards to the inspection thing he had a survey done the week before so how often can he do an inspection with 24 hrs notice.
what about the fact that he didnt do an inspection he only entered my hall and toilet surely an inspection would cover a little more of my flat.

As for letting it go on for so long believe it or not im not a complainer however when i do eventually get my teeth into something im like a pitbull.

i take it im going to have to speak to a lawyer regarding the small claims court and how much compensation to go for i have no idea if a precedent has been set or is it on a case by case thing

Harry
23-03-2006, 14:55 PM
I looked round a flat a few weeks ago that had a cracked window, which had apparently been like that for a year or so.

I really don't get it - a fiver for a bit of glass, a tub of putty and 20 minutes' work. Why does this sort of repair become such a big deal for a landlord?

By the same token, if the tenant is genuinely suffering so much, why not spend a few minutes fixing it, so that you can have a comfortable life, then get on the landlord's back about reimbursement?

pms
23-03-2006, 15:35 PM
[QUOTE=Harry]I looked round a flat a few weeks ago that had a cracked window, which had apparently been like that for a year or so.

I really don't get it - a fiver for a bit of glass, a tub of putty and 20 minutes' work. Why does this sort of repair become such a big deal for a landlord?

Harry: I see your point and that would be the realistic thing to do.But the law is the law.If it says the Landlord has to repair it he has too.

mattyg
28-03-2006, 17:09 PM
Another Update:
I called into the shop below my flat today and there where two letters for me well one addressed to the occupier saying we have been instructed by my landlord that he and a surveyor will be calling and will require access to my flat on fri 31st march. and if access is refused or prevented bt myself then i will be in breach of clause 3 (17) of my tenancy agreement

the other letter addressed to me is a s21
its dated the 28th march 06 but the order is for the 24th june 06 or the other date being two months from the service of the notice.

(which date is it) neither has been deleted as stated at the bottom of the form

So is this harrasment i meen he had a survey done near the end of feb then broke into my flat on the 7th march now want to do another survey on the 31st march.
so do i set up my cctv again deny him access and see if he breaks in again.
or write a letter to his solicitor stating he can have access after im gone in five months time unless he pays me x amount of compensation and ill surrender tenancy early

justaboutsane
28-03-2006, 21:57 PM
Its your home and as such you can refuse access to anyone you like! .. If you say no whether its in your AST or not he cannot break in! If he does it is harrasement.

You should take the section 21 to your local housing office .. if your AST does not expire until 24th June your Ll cannot evict you until then.

mattyg
29-03-2006, 18:00 PM
ok as i was leaving this am i came across another letter pinned to the outside of my front door. from the landlord saying he requires access to do an inspection on fri between 12:30 and 1pm.

what is this guy on he broke in and did an inspection on the 7th now he wants to do another one.
so thats a survey at 12 noon and an inspection between 12:30-1pm

So this is what i beleive to be happening:

The property is on the market i allow a survey to be carried out towards the mid-end of feb.(we hadnt fallen out by this point). the survey was fairly negative with regards to the roof structure and windows as well as other points.

So either the sale has fallen through or he needs a second opinion. Either way i think i have him over a barrell. He needs to get access i wont allow it if he breaks in again thats Harrasment the police will have do do something then surely. If i sit tight it could take him 5 months to get me out. so no sale for at least 5 months.
I had contacted him saying if he pays x amount to his lawyer as soon as i have confirmation there a funds waiting for me i will surrender my tenancy early and i wont pursue a claim for compensation. he must have thought i was bluffing. So do i take the day off work and lie in wait for him with my sisters two german shepards or set up my cctv again and catch him in my flat.
oh if i were to fit a padlock to my living room door so he would only have access to my hall kitchen and bathroom if he removed the lock by force is that criminal damage.

thanks for all your input
matt

mattyg
29-03-2006, 18:50 PM
another point with regards to giving consent for the landlord to enter my flat he has written on the letter that if its not conveniant than i should call the surveyor however if i do nothing is that as good as giving consent as i hadnt said no

Ericthelobster
29-03-2006, 19:13 PM
oh if i were to fit a padlock to my living room door so he would only have access to my hall kitchen and bathroom if he removed the lock by force is that criminal damage.Well if this was on a door in a house you rented from me, then yes, I'd probably call it criminal damage. By you! (in fitting the padlock to my lovingly painted door.)

Well - obviously if you were my tenant, you wouldn't have a harassing landlord who enters without permission, so you wouldn't feel the need to fit a padlock... nevertheless, all I'm trying to say is that I don't think it's a great idea!

Jennifer_M
29-03-2006, 21:38 PM
To be honest you should simply stop playing games.

If you want to stay in that place until the end of the tenancy than just do and tell your landlord that you do not want anyone to enter the property ever until you leave and if anyone does you'll have to take actions (or authorise visits if you feel like it).

If the place is bad and you want to leave then tell him that you want to leave, would he agree to release you from any financial commitments etc. If he disagrees then stay put, if he agrees then go.

If what you want is the property to be repaired then write him a letter saying you want X, Y and Z to be fixed within X days (allow reasonable time) or you will have to get 3 quotes and get it fixed yourself and you'll be deducting the cost from your rent.

davidjohnbutton
29-03-2006, 23:09 PM
Having read this thread I do concur with Jennifer.

Mattyg - if you decide to play silly buggers with alsations and threatening behaviour as well as potentially committing an offence of blackmail i.e. "I had contacted him saying if he pays x amount to his lawyer as soon as i have confirmation there a funds waiting for me i will surrender my tenancy early and i wont pursue a claim for compensation." you start to get onto dangerous ground and it then starts to become an "you did this and I did that" scenario and the only winners will be the solicitors that your landlord and you will have to employ to untangle the situation.

Make it simple - warn the landlord no visits without your permission - if he or anyone acting on his behalf ignores that and breaks in then report it to the police and the local authority. Allow your landlord reasonable access for repairs and for inspecting the property with or without a surveyor because if you don't, then he can take you to court for an order allowing access which will cost you dearly!

The local authority will help you get repairs done if your landlord does not do them.

Personally, I think you are falling into the "compensation culture" trap - and think that automatically compensation is payable if the landlord does anything naughty - thats not always so because sometimes there is another side to the coin.

I had a tenant many years ago that was in arrears with his rent all the time - soon as I commenced legal action, he reported various repairs to the environmental health (without ever mentioning them to me, and I could not inspect as he would not allow access), the local authority ignored my protests and served a notice on me to do the repairs - I was unable to comply as I could not get access - verified by independent repairmen as witnesses - local authority decided to prosecute me but dropped it and paid me compensation to cover my legal bill when witness statements from the repairmen were sent in. That tenant was subsequently evicted, costing me thousands of £s in legal fees, court fees and lost rent and damage to the house. I invited the LA to come and look at the state of the house when it was repossessed - they were not in the slighted interested!!!!!! It seems there is no legislation to support a landlord complaining about his tenant - only the other way around!!!