T of 23yrs. standing has new L; what happens now?

[vonnie happs]

we have rented premises for 23 years, (with no formal agreement). we have now recieved one phone call from landlord to say that he has sold the premises to a developer.can someone please tell us what rights we have(if any). we have a good business that we have built up over the years and do not want to relocate(having said that we have been round all the agents in the area and there are no premises suitable for our needs anyway...we have not had any notification from the new owners as to where we stand.PLEASE HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!THANKS........

[Editor]

The fact that you have no formal agreement does not mean that you don't have a valid tenancy, which will mean that you have protection under statutory rules, namely the Landlord & Tenant Act 1954.
This is no different under an new landlord. You have security of tenure.
If the new landlord wants possesion to re-develop the property he will need approval from the courts.
One of the grounds for re-possession is for re-development, but you will be entitled to compensation if the court were to award this.

[vonnie happs]

further to my last thread, could anyone enlighten us as to the following few questions.....our new landlord has made it clear that he wants us to relocate, he has informed us of a building that would be suitable for some of our requirements although we are not sure yet wether the local council will allow it to be used for paint spraying, (which is approx 40% of our business), if we were to be granted the permission, and decided to move, could we expect to get the same deal as we have got at the existing premises, ie non repairing, long term agreement(as we do not want to be in the same position as we have now found ourselves) with a similar sort of rent deal. Also could we ask the landlord who is desperate to get us out to come up with a relocation allowance. ie, to help with the costs of moving our existing business, so that he can get his property back without the need for going through the courts. We have talked to local surveyers and solicitors but none seem to have the answer. Has anyone had experiance of this sort of dilemma,,,,,, many thanks to anyone who can help....

[Editor]

In the end, this all comes down to negotiation.
Your landlord wants to re-develop (one of the grounds for possession, providing his reason is genuine) but if you object this could become a long, drawn out and expensive process for the landlord, which I am sure he would rather avoid.
In addition, if the landlord is successful he will still need to compensate you for the disruption.
So, if he is offering alternative accommodation, you don't say whether this belongs to the same landlord, it is up to you to negotiate the best deal you can, using the threat of the above as a counter.

[vonnie happs]

Thank You... the property that is available does not belong to our new landlord, although to cut a long story short, the property is owned by a man who has is in the past bought and developed property jointly with our new landlord, although he is not involved in the purchase and development of our current premises. we are wondering if he is doing our new landlord a favour by offering it to us so that his friend can get us to go quickly and quietly,without the need for the court procedure and then try to use the fact that we have given up our rights, and throw us out of the new premises.This is our main worry.as we do not want to be in the same position in a few months time as we are now.MANY, MANY THANKS TO YOU..

[Paul_f]

As Tom the Editor has pointed out you have an extremely strong case for remaining where you are and if you do have to eventually move it will cost the landlord a large amount of money and time.

As they want to redevelop the land then it's going to make them £000's so don't be intimidated. Even if you can be relocated I would want several years' rent as compensation in addition to all my legal costs being paid by them. Negotiate hard! Probably a good idea to get your solicitor involved.

[vonnie happs]

hi again.
have now been served with a section 25 noice, wants us out nov 05.he has offerered us £ 2500 each to go without making a fuss. if we went to court to try for a new tenancy, and were unsuccessful does anyone know wether the court would grant us extra time to move out or would it still have to be november.would really appreciate any comments. have passed all the paperwork to solicitor but you know how long winded these things can be and we would really like to know as soon as possible..
many thanks. vonne

[daveyjp]

I've just been asked to look at an agreement we had with a tenant who was forced to move as a result of the site he was in being redeveloped - all above board there's a nice Audi dealership on the site now - he moved in to a property we were developing. He ran a small recording studio - no more than 500 sq ft of old mill premises - his settlement was £2,500 statutory compensation (based on the rateable value), £17,500 for disturbance, loss of profit etc, £200 for advertising, £200 to move his phones and a ten year deal on the rent and service charge at his new premises. I hope you can see from this that the £2,500 offer you have received seems 'light' to say the least!

[Tax Accountant]

I am not in the legal profession and therefore the following reply is based on my sketchy knowkedge which may not be complete or accurate. Therefore, please read it with a pinch of salt.

I agree that you will have the protection of the Landlord and Tenant Act 1954 and therefore you can only be evicted by serving a 6 month notice to quit under Section 25 of the act. This notice has been issued to you to quit by 5 November 2005. I also assume that they have specified the relevant grounds for which they require the premises. They would also have presumably stated that they are not proposing to issue a new lease to you.

You will have the right to apply to the courts for a new lease. In deciding whether you to do so, the court will look at your existing tenancy. As you say that you do not have a written tenancy agreement, the court will determine that you have an implied or an oral tenancy with the terms and conditions based on how your tenancy has been regulated thus far.

The most important issue to determine would be whether your tenancy has come to an end, and if so, on which date. You could presumably have an oral tenancy with the landlord whereby he had agreed that you will have the tenancy for as long as your business continues, or for only 25 years or from year to year. If this is determined as a yearly tenancy from year to year, the tenancy comes to an end if either party decides not to renew it. If they determine that your tenancy has come to an end, it is most likely that the court will give order for you to quit the premises. In this event, I believe that the only compensation that you will be entitled under law will be 2 x the ratable value (see your business rates bill). This will not amount to much. I don't believe that you will be entitled to any other compensation or even legal costs. If the developers are anxious to get you out quickly and offer you larger amounts, good luck to you.

The landlords have no duty to relocate you, so don't look at a gift horse in the mouth if you are offered other suitable premises at reasonable rent and with a proper long term lease.

I believe that your strongest card is that the court may decide that you have an oral tenancy for the duration of your business, ie, as long as the business lasts. Even so, you will be required to pay the market rent.

Best advice to you is to retain a good solicitor who is well versed in Landlord and Tenant Act 1954. An average property conveyancing solicitor will not be much use to you.

But also beware that legal costs can mount up very easily.

Perhaps the Editor or any other suitably experienced contributor would care to comment on the above post and its flaws.